[ddavidv]

Sunday I made a deal with someone desperate for cash on this somewhat cafe'd '07 Deluxe.

The seller got it from a relative who told him it "Only needs $80 worth of parts to run", mostly a valve seat and intake valve. Yeah, right! Totally unplanned I had a week off from work and was able to start right into fixing the four thousand things wrong with it. This being my first RE I wasn't sure how it would be to work on but it has been a delight. Everything is easy to access and it goes together logically. I've had a fun week thus far but have found so many things wrong with it I've lost count.

Aside from a bad head, bad piston, 'modified' electrics, a rear wheel that I don't think was aligned properly, rust in the fuel tank, missing parts etc it appears the primary chain is either way stretched or possibly the wrong one. Slack is ridiculous and if I lift the tensioner up the chain contacts the bracing on the inside of the case...where apparently someone once tried it and ground some of it away!

I mean, this can't be right, can it? I plan on ordering a new one along with the multitude of other things I need.

One other issue I have is the handlebar controls won't get tight on the bars. They 'spin' pretty easily with the screws fully seated. This makes the throttle unusable, among other things. Anyone have a fix?
ETA: I mean on the stock bars. Those idiotic cafe bars are already on the floor.

[mrunderhill1975a]

I believe the tech manual says 1/4 inch slack for the primary chain. Yours is way too much.  Perhaps someone installed a "high performance" clutch basket with too few teeth. 

All bullets have rear wheels that look like they are not aligned properly compared with fender.  They all look like they are off to one side.  When you get past the primary chain problem, you can worry about wheel alignment.

The bars may be slightly smaller diameter than stock for the controls.  In my case, I used a short wrap of thin corrugated/expanded metal from an old body putty shaping tool. The thin metal blade took up the extra space and the rough corrugations provided grip on the bar.  A wrap of metal window screen material could also help.

Check out this link to Classic Motorcycles:
https://www.motorcycleclassics.com/mc-how-to/replace-primary-chain-zmmz16jfzhur


Looks like fun. Good luck.

[ddavidv]

Nice find on that article. I get that magazine and have the archive but didn't realize they ever published that.
Just placed a slightly painful order with Hitchcock's.

[Adrian II]

Those dropped bars won't be good for use with stock footrests, perhaps a set of normal 7/8" handlebars from a British bike specialist would be kinder to your back.

All the stock Bullet controls are for 7/8" bars and should not need padding out unless they were a poor fit to start with. However the throttle assembly/switch cluster on the electric start models did have a locating pin matched to a hole in the right-side of the handlebar, if you have after-market bars the previous owner might not have taken this into account when fitting them. I cant remember if this was a short metal pin or a protrusion from the plastic molding, which the P.O. might have ground off in ignorance! I will check my old Electra-X throttle assembly if I can find it and let you know.

A.

[mrunderhill1975a]

https://www.motorcycleclassics.com/mc-how-to/replace-primary-chain-zmmz16jfzhur

One thing I would add to this replacement procedure is the clutch drum retaining Circlip.  Perhaps it is different on the E-start bikes but my kick-start bike has a large circlip holding the clutch drum to the inner hub.  When you pull on the drum with the puller, make certain there is no circlip holding it in place. 

One other thing, for reassembly, is to make certain of the position of the innermost  and outer-most clutch discs,  the innermost "reaches" toward the gearbox, the outer-most plate "reaches" away from the gearbox.

gearbox----}IlIlIl{---primary cover

Just be sure the plates go back in the same orientation as they came out.
I hope that makes sense.

[ddavidv]

Those drop bars are off and laying on the floor. Free to anyone who wants them. They were horrible!

[Bilgemaster]

Those drop bars are off and laying on the floor. Free to anyone who wants them. They were horrible!

Actually, I might be able to use them on my old Norton N15CS "Desert Sled" currently awaiting resurrection if I were to reorient them upwards. Are they like the old  "Z-Bars"? 'Cause the Norton had them when I first got it together. They broke at one of the welds when I came off once, and I sort of miss them. Could I see a picture?

Oh, and my 2005 Electric Start did have that big clutch retaining circlip mentioned by Mr. Underhill. It was very easy to pry out with a narrowish flathead screwdriver, and I didn't need a special puller to get off that clutch basket. It just wiggled off pleasantly enough along with the chain and that drive sprocket underneath the alternator rotor. The trickiest part was reassembly, and making sure the gap between the alternator rotor and stator was nice and even, which can be achieved by a little shimming of the stator mounts and/or a little light persuasion with a rubber mallet of the stator before final tightening of the stator mounting nuts. Hoohoohoblin has a superb YouTube video of the process. In fact, if you're new to wrenching on the Iron Bellied breed, I'd recommend binge-watching all his stuff.

[ddavidv]

More questions.
The bike came with no air filter of any kind. The 'box' and all the plumbing are gone and the tool box is filled with all manner of electrics moved from the frame for aesthetic purposes (which creates other problems I need to fix). Anyway, I am not in love with the original setup. Don't like the K&N look on something this antiquated. I'd like to use something like a 'pancake' filter often seen on Triumphs and the like. Any negatives to doing this?

I'm also trying to figure out a muffler as there is none. Not a fan of the giant salami it was built with. There is a 'shorty' muffler available (used) for around $100 I could get or the Gold Star type at around $125 new.

Testing the electrics and figuring out what severed wires go to what I found the turn signal power for the rear. The front trafficator lights function with the switch in that they come on but don't blink. Do the rear lights also have to be in place for the flash to function or do I have a problem with the relay/flasher?

There is no front brake light switch. Is this a common part from another bike like some of the switchgear (Suzuki)? I sort of know what it looks like.

Points look good and it generates a nice spark when kicked over but I'd like to carry a spare set. I've read that these are 'common Lucas' components but it would help to know what other bike application I can specify to order a set locally.

Running out of things to work on until my package from Hitchcock's arrives.

[ace.cafe]

I still make the Ace Air Canister on special order. Takes about a week. Has vintage look, proper airbox volume, correct length intake hose for ram effects, and comes with a low cost easy to replace filter element available from AutoZone. Can also accept a K&N E-3120. Bracket and connector hose included and all assembled for quick installation.

This was my most popular product for Iron Barrel 500 models.

Pic below.

[ddavidv]

That isn't what I had in mind but...looks kinda nifty!  Can you quote me here or in a PM?
Seems all of the filters I like are thread on to Amal carbs.
My carb bolts directly to the head but yours has a piece of hose connecting it?

[ace.cafe]

That isn't what I had in mind but...looks kinda nifty!  Can you quote me here or in a PM?
Seems all of the filters I like are thread on to Amal carbs.
My carb bolts directly to the head but yours has a piece of hose connecting it?

All Bullets have a hose connecting the carb mouth to the airbox.
All India made Bullets have a short hose connecting the carb(Mikarb 28mm) to a manifold stub on the head. That is the way all the Mikuni carbs attach.

Amal carbs have a flange that bolts to the head. This flange is extremely delicate, and overtightening it will warp the carb body permanently, causing unending problems. So, don't overtighten the carb flange bolts, and pray that the previous owner didn't overtighten them.

In any case, regarding my Ace Air Canister, it fits both the Mikarb and Amal carbs, and replaces the stock airbox and filter, and mounts to the original airbox mounting bolt.

The reason for using an airbox is that it has sufficient internal air volume so that the engine can fill the cylinder with air from inside the airbox without having to pull air thru the filter mesh. Then, the air can come thru the filter mesh during the next 3 strokes and be ready for the next intake stroke. This allows better throttle response and cylinder filling potential. The intent for this kit was to meet all the desired requirements for its purposes, and replace the poor OEM filter/airbox arrangement with a better one that keeps a vintage appearance.

The pod type filters that clamp/bolt on the carb mouth do not have sufficient internal volume for the purposes described above. They work, but are not ideal, which is why all factory engines use an airbox, and so do most aftermarket intake/filter systems that offer real performance benefits.

The kit is $89.95 plus shipping. I have sold hundreds of these over the last 10 years. If the Photo Gallery on this forum was still working, you would see many members bikes with these on them. The photo I posted was of another member's bike that put an Ace Air Canister on it, and posted a photo after he installed it on his bike. That photo is almost 10 years old now.

You can PM me if you want to order one.

[ddavidv]

The carb on mine bolts directly to the head. Not the correct carb?

[ace.cafe]

The carb on mine bolts directly to the head. Not the correct carb?

That appears to be a JRC carb. Probably 30mm.
Not as commonly seen as the factory Mikarb, aftermarket Mikuni, or aftermarket Amal.

They take a 30mm Chinese copy of a Keihin PWK carb, epoxy a flange for a Bullet on it. It was a fairly common carb upgrade sold here by the previous importer. The jets may not be identical to Keihin, and should be available on eBay.
Look on the carb body for a name like OKO or KOSO. You will want to get jets for whatever brand is on the carb body.

I can't remember if that fits my airbox connectors or not. I can fit 1.75" or 2.25" carb mouths, with a little leeway because the hose can stretch a bit.

Back in the way old days when the Bullets were built in England, an Amal was the factory carb.

[ddavidv]

The inlet measures 50mm if that helps.
No brand name on it but "30m" is stamped in it and "PWK" is cast in the housing on the other side.

[ace.cafe]

The inlet measures 50mm if that helps.
No brand name on it but "30m" is stamped in it and "PWK" is cast in the housing on the other side.

It is a pretty good carb upgrade for a stock bike. Not sure on how to guide you about jets to get.

My airbox connector hose probably wouldn't stretch from 45mm to 50mm,.and the 57mm hose would be too big.

[pushrod]

 Looks like Ace nailed it https://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/british-standard-jrc-30mm-carburetors-pwk-keihin-replace-amal-930-and-mikuni.html

[Adrian II]

My airbox connector hose probably wouldn't stretch from 45mm to 50mm,.and the 57mm hose would be too big.

Now THIS might work, a 57 to 51mm reducing hose, the extra 1mm at the carb end would squeeze down well enough without too much protest, just a decent clip. A purist might want a strip of shim around the carb mouth. You might be able to find one of these in black.



ttps://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Blue-Silicone-Hose-Straight-Reducer-57-51mm-by-ASH-57mm-to-51mm/200981314501?hash=item2ecb6b7bc5:m:mAvE0Qnhg-G14EFKTmlZsNg

A.

[ddavidv]

Corrected measurement with digital caliper 48mm.

Another subject. Front brake handle is very floppy. Took it off and the pivot pin is very loose inside the handle. Being aluminum I'm wondering if it is the lever hole that is worn? I doubt I can find a bushing to tighten it up.

[Adrian II]

Being aluminum I'm wondering if ...

So you're made of aluminum??? 
 
New front brake lever assemblies can be bought cheaply off ebay, it's probably not worth trying to fix it .

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROYAL-ENFIELD-FRONT-BRAKE-LEVER-ASSLY-SWITCH/333166500255?hash=item4d9245599f:g:-wQAAOSwMpFcLLra

A.

[ddavidv]

The questions keep coming (and I have several unanswered, if y'all want to scroll back through). Mine came with essentially no battery so I have nothing to match up at the battery store. Can anyone provide the size/model? Batteries usually have a 'group number'.

[Adrian II]

According to the on-line parts book its a Yuasa YB14L-A2 132mm x 90mm x 168mm.  Now cross-reference that with the Motobatt list and buy their AGM version, which is a big improvement.

A.

[ddavidv]

Replaced the primary chain last night. There is NO WAY the chain in there was for that bike. New one adjusts out perfectly.

If it weren't for fixing all the PO 'repairs' this thing would probably be running by now.

[Adrian II]

There is a certain satisfaction to be had from seeing various screwed-up things put right, however frustrating it is when you first find them.

Something about the Bullet seems to encourage this kind of thing, unfortunately.

A.

[Arizoni]

Replaced the primary chain last night. There is NO WAY the chain in there was for that bike. New one adjusts out perfectly.

If it weren't for fixing all the PO 'repairs' this thing would probably be running by now.

Sounds like the previous owner was a guy who believes in the old saying, "If it isn't broken, fix it until it is." 

[ddavidv]

The 'fixing' is sort of the point of this project so ultimately I don't mind it. What is a bit off-putting is the idea that, had I not decided to check the fluid level of the primary (there wasn't any!) I never would have found that chain flopping about. Scary. I can't imagine the backlash on/off throttle.

Today's question:  how do I fit a battery to this thing? PO had stuck some tiny gel type battery in the left tool box which I'm not keen on. There is no battery carrier. I found one on Ebay from a '99 but according to Hitchcock's the correct one for mine is "Electric Start Only" which leads me to believe the earlier one may not work. The proper one is very pricey.

Without the battery in place I'm uncertain of the clearance for an air cleaner. I've found this one but wonder if it may be too big? https://www.ebay.com/itm/High-Quality-Metal-With-Rubber-Connector-Mushroom-Head-Air-Filter-Cleaner-48mm/202515518206?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Edit:  I found this photo from an older post showing a battery mounted in the left tool box. I'm becoming more okay with this idea if I can figure out a way to secure the battery in there.

[ace.cafe]

The battery carrier is different for the ES models because the ES uses a 14ah battery, and KS models use a 5ah battery. Significant size difference, but they both mount to the same frame lug.

There is plenty of room for an airbox or filter because the airbox mounts to the same frame lug as the battery box, except on the other side of the frame.

[Adrian II]

The electric start 14AH battery box and cover, they are available in chrome or black.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/14AMP-BATTERY-BOX-CHROME-COMPLETE-ASSEMBLY-ROYAL-ENFIELD-CLASSIC-UK/222165679697?hash=item33ba1b3e51:g:ZC8AAOSw3YNXbo7B

A.

[ddavidv]

Where do the turn signal relay and the starter solenoid attach? Both seem to have a rubber holder with a slot in it like they would slide over a metal tab on something.

[Bilgemaster]

Where do the turn signal relay and the starter solenoid attach? Both seem to have a rubber holder with a slot in it like they would slide over a metal tab on something.

I've got a reasonably unmolested 2005 "Military". If this long patch of rainy misery ever lets up, I'll see if I can't get a couple of clear shots of the relays and whatnot in situ. In the meantime, here are the pages of the "Switches and Fitments" section (13 - 20) of the Spare Parts Catalog ...

[GlennF]

The size and type of the battery you need is not a set thing. It is going to depend partly on how often you intend to use the electric start and under what circumstances.  Obviously a summer only once a day ride that is usually kickstarted (unless you stall at the lights and need to get away quickly) will be a lot less demanding on the battery then something that is electric started multiple times a day all year around for example.  Too small it will not handle cold weather electric starts. Unless you go stupidly oversized with a battery (in which case the charging system may have issues if it runs flat) the only issue with big is physically fitting it.  Also, if the bike is likely to sit for long periods without being ridden an AGM battery loses less charge per month but costs more.

[ddavidv]

I've disabled the electrics for the starter as a sprag safety measure. I found a battery box and cover for $60 used. Debating which way I want to go. I like the idea of having the tool box for storage but OTOH having that big case hanging on the side (and nothing on the opposite side) isn't terribly appealing. First world problems.

I have four gallons of vinegar in my garage waiting to see the inside of the fuel tank. Can I just leave the petcock in place or should I remove it and plug the fitting somehow?

[Adrian II]

A 1/4" BSP (gas thread) plug should be cheap enough.

Ref the empty space opposite the battery box, one of those oval repro 50's Bullet air filter boxes would look the part, Hitchcocks' have them, though ebay has (varying quality) examples for sale from India.

A.

[Bilgemaster]

The monsoons having ceased, here at last are those promised shots of the more-or-less stock electrical rat's nest under the saddle and also the mystery jumble within in the left hand sidecover for your ready reference. Hope this helps!

[Bilgemaster]

Here's that sidebox one...

Lemme know if you need any special view, or I could break out the Harbor Freight Inspection Camera and get all "proctological" up in there with the world's dullest YouTube video.

[ddavidv]

Well that answered some questions. I'm missing the metal tab things that hold the relays just in front of the finned aluminum whatchamacallits under the seat.

My starter solenoid looks nothing like yours. It also has a rubber boot thing that looks like it would slide over a tab. I've removed it for now as I don't plan on using the ES.

I also don't have the canooter valve in the tool box. There is a badly made hole in about the same position where the PO installed a push button for the starter.

[Bilgemaster]

If you plan on digging around in the primary again and removing the clutch basket, rotor, stator, drive sprocket and chain, then you might do well to remove the whole gear cluster containing the starter clutch sprag. For some reason that passeth all understanding, they only made the sprag nonsense accessible by removal of three Allen screws from within the primary with all its guts removed. My starter sprag clutch gave up the ghost recently, albeit blessedly gently and with minimal shrapnel or mayhem, even though I rarely used it, and hadn't used the starter in weeks when it went. That sprag just shit the bed all on its own, as described in this thread.

[ddavidv]

A smart guy would have thought ahead and done that. But a smart guy didn't buy this bike, LOL. I guess my 'thinking' was I'd keep everything intact in case I wanted to wire the starter back in for a 'just in case it's needed' situation though I have no idea why that would ever be necessary. Well, whatever. It's back together now. I'll wait until some new reason to go in there to mess with it.

Four gallons of vinegar fermenting in the fuel tank currently. I shone my little light inside and was appalled at how much brown scale there was everywhere.

[tooseevee]

Edit:  I found this photo from an older post showing a battery mounted in the left tool box. I'm becoming more okay with this idea if I can figure out a way to secure the battery in there.

       I used closed cell foam both in back of and in front of the battery to secure mine very tightly when the cover is closed and locked. The cover squeezes the battery in there nicely when the cover is closed. I was also very fussy with the terminals to make sure they could never touch the cover when closed.

[ddavidv]

Seats: anyone have experience with the unsprung solo seat from Hitchcock's 91475? I like the look of it vs the sprung models. If I went sprung I'd choose the 'classic' saddle 91415.
Maybe this should be a separate post to generate more responses?

[ace.cafe]

I used an unsprung seat for years. It wasn't a Hitchcocks seat, but I would expect that it was similar comfort.

Never felt uncomfortable on it.

[Bilgemaster]

Getting back to that starter sprag clutch, whatever lube you're using in the primary (on advice from these Forums I use Type F Automatic Transmission Fluid, though the manual calls for 10W40), you might do well to add another 400 or so ml, or about a cup and a half, above that 420 ml level of the fluid level screw to better bathe that sprag gear. It seems there was some factory service advisory that went out some years back to that effect. It didn't save mine, which went tits up at about 9,000 miles, though very rarely used, but might help forestall the inevitable crunch with yours... especially if you NEVER use it.

[ddavidv]

Yeah, so about the final drive oil...I've heard "Type F" but Snidal seems to think in a five speed model it should be 20W or 20W-50 if straight isn't available.

[ace.cafe]

Getting back to that starter sprag clutch, whatever lube you're using in the primary (on advice from these Forums I use Type F Automatic Transmission Fluid, though the manual calls for 10W40), you might do well to add another 400 or so ml, or about a cup and a half, above that 420 ml level of the fluid level screw to better bathe that sprag gear. It seems there was some factory service advisory that went out some years back to that effect. It didn't save mine, which went tits up at about 9,000 miles, though very rarely used, but might help forestall the inevitable crunch with yours... especially if you NEVER use it.

Actually, you could use Dexron/Mercon ATF or similar if the main reason is to lube the spray clutch. The sprag is a part repurposed from a GM automatic transmission torque converter.

The Type F ATF is to help stop clutch slippage if it slips with the regular ATF.

Technically, the factory calls for engine oil, but the ATF is better for certain, things, and it is easy to differentiate a primary fluid leak from an engine oil leak, by the color.

Use what you prefer. Those are the basics about the choices  available.

Yeah, so about the final drive oil...I've heard "Type F" but Snidal seems to think in a five speed model it should be 20W or 20W-50 if straight isn't available.

Use standard low sulfur or no sulfur(preferable) gear oil in the gearbox. 85/90w is fine.

[ddavidv]

I want to check with the collective before I hack this thing up into a pair of turn signal brackets...this is not a Bullet part is it? This came with my bike but was attached to one of the K-Mart solo seats that I'm not using. I don't want to chop it into bits if it is actually for something on a Bullet.

[ace.cafe]

It looks like the factory airbox bracket.

[tooseevee]

Yeah, so about the final drive oil...I've heard "Type F" but Snidal seems to think in a five speed model it should be 20W or 20W-50 if straight isn't available.

         Nope. You've confused transmission (final) with chain case (primary). No mention in Snidal of ATF in the transmission. The ATF recommendation is for the chain case (primary) not the tranny (final).

[ddavidv]

Dammit. I just know some day I'll wish I'd kept it. Guess I'm using some bar stock, LOL.

[ddavidv]

Remember this carb?
https://scontent.fagc1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/58463169_10157213206631055_9177211832891342848_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_eui2=AeH7nNmxZWCrg-A-V7e3Kx-8Lhlyrbw-o8jQmtQvCkfYBOADJ0MzqpAX4IdEDCXPHSheF0DbSX_MAb9DAYbT3lCZ0paZYJnUSG9CbfTp7QqGtw&_nc_ht=scontent.fagc1-1.fna&oh=f1e171ccebafef7496b8ab653357b647&oe=5D72FD1A

I removed the float bowl to clean/check it (was in great shape) and now can't get it back on. Asking on another generic bike site apparently these things can be real bastards. I've spent an hour over two nights trying to get it back together and the planets simply won't line up. Anyone know the secret?

And to add to the joy I found a pinhole in my vinegar fermenting gas tank today. 

Tiny upside:  I got a used chain guard off Ebay that went on easily and actually was in nice shape (black).

[ddavidv]

Four day weekend for me so lots of work in the garage.
I wired up rear turn signals and was going to add matching ones in the front but don't see any leads behind the headlamp for them. Are the little lights in the headlamp nacelle supposed to function as indicators? When I turn the switch L or R the proper light will illuminate.
No blinky though. Right turn the flasher unit emits a buzz and no lamp. Left turn the lamp stays on but no noise from the flasher. I stuck another flasher in I had laying around but it doesn't do anything and I don't even get a lamp to light so it may be a dud.

I bought acetone to try to melt what is left of the fuel tank liner out. There are only a couple of spots I can't get loose. Rest of the tank cleaned out pretty nicely.

Spent a lot of time adjusting the brakes. The one cam wasn't returning to rest and it took me quite awhile to figure out the adjustments between the hub and the cable itself. Finally seems to be working properly but the previous setup at the handle didn't have the adjustment knob and sleeve. The cable was attached to the handle and the cable sheath just sits in the end of the handle pivot. I'm questioning if the cable on it is the correct one as the end that fits into the handle seems too small.

I also bought this very nice seat from Hitchcock's but am puzzled by the front mounting. It is just a tab that points forward. Shouldn't there be something that holds it in the bracket on the frame? The only hardware it came with was the two mounting legs for the rear.

[Bilgemaster]

Speaking only to the rear drum brake issues, I'm led to understand that in many cases the actuating cam plate, which should be free-floating on that brake plate so as to evently distribute force to both shoes, may be factory-painted in place or too-tightly affixed and attached with immobile star washers in such a way as to hinder its desired side-to-side movement to level out its action. The result is poor single-shoe braking.

[ace.cafe]

The seat tongue just slides under the front frame bracket .

[ddavidv]

The seat tongue just slides under the front frame bracket .

Any concern with the harness running through there?

[ace.cafe]

It depends on the fit. If the seat pan prevents the tongue from touching the harness, it's ok. If not, adjust where needed.

[ddavidv]

Turn signals sorted. Apparently the system is very particular about the bulbs used. With a matching pair of 4w in the nacelle and a car flasher from my parts stash they work.

I went to put the headlamp back in and discovered the three leads to the lamp are all separate...and I didn't label where they went.  Anyone able to tell me which colors go where? I have amber, blue and green. The wiring diagrams I have are all vague about actual attachment points.

[Adrian II]

Look at the back of the headlamp reflector unit with the bulb in. The amber wire is the AC return, that fits on the left-hand tab of the H4 bulb, blue is main beam and fits on the right hand tab, and green is dipped beam which fits on the top tab.

A.

[ddavidv]

Thank you! 

I filled the fluids today except for the gas. Tank got the acetone treatment today. I'm letting it evaporate before sticking a lamp inside to see if I got the last of the liner out. Ordered a horn, muffler and air filter from Ebay and Amazon. One oddball bolt needed to install the seat. I have yet to:  bolt down and torque head, install rocker arms, install rocker covers, set valve/pushrod clearances, install oil lines, install exhaust, hook up decompressor, install battery and tidy up the wiring. If the fuel tank cleaned up  I can Red Kote it and let it dry for a few days and put that on.

At that point I should be ready to give it a few kicks!

[ddavidv]

Flummoxed. I know what a compression release does and understand in theory how it works. It was apart when I got the bike so I'm going by the parts diagram to put it together. It was rather a struggle as I waited until the head was on the engine to do it. But, here is what I have.


Per the parts diagram the sequence of assembled parts looks correct but it doesn't seem to do anything. If I move the control lever the cable housing just pops out of it. I stared at it for awhile and just can't grasp how it is supposed to function. I'm sure I don't have something right somewhere but can't figure out what.

[Bilgemaster]

Sounds to me like you might enjoy the probing and insightful short Art Film, "Decompressor Operation Thrills for Dirty Uncle Vanya".

Pro Tip: DO NOT EVEN TOUCH that split or cotter pin on the decompressor assembly while it's anywhere near  the head...unless, of course, you want  to spend a lazy afternoon trying to fish the decompression valve out of the cylinder bore with a magnet.

[mrunderhill1975a]

When you say "cable housing" do you mean the threaded ferrule shown in your photo or do you mean the lever on the handle bars?

The decompressor assembly has a slot where the ball of the cable resides. Is this cable ball secure in the slot in the decompressor assembly?  If ball is secure, then when the lever pulls on the cable, the sheath (Bowden tube) around the cable pushes on that threaded ferrule in your photo, which in turn pushes down on the spring and opens the decompressor valve.  If nothing happens in your case, either the ball on the end of the cable is not attached securely in the slot, the ball is deformed and slides through the slot, or the threaded ferrule has stripped threads and the ferrule is slipping through the top of the valve assembly.

[ddavidv]

It looks like the valve is together correctly. The cable operation is not working properly though.
I made a quick and dirty phone video showing my issues (click link; I don't know how to embed). https://youtu.be/EoXRDWDNwp0

[Seipgam]

Looks like your cable is stretched, maybe time for a new one (cheap on ebay).

Viewing your video, the action you want is what you're getting when you say you are "holding it". The cable inner looks to be stretched and looks like there is not enough adjustment left at the decompressor end.  A new cable will sort it.

Geoff.

[mrunderhill1975a]

Yep, either the cable stretched or the Bowden tube has been shortened.  If you have access to appropriate size ferrules, you could add two ferrules to the lever end of the Bowden tube and effectively lengthening the Bowden tube, which would in turn effectively shorten the cable. 

Lacking a source for ferrules, you could manufacture your own by using copper/brass pipe, nylon tube spacers, large roll pins which can be found in a hardware fastener bin.

[ddavidv]

Home stretch!
The fuel tank seems to have cleaned itself of old liner. I'll Red Kote it probably Sunday.

Installed the exhaust pipe and my Emgo muffler arrived today. Unfortunately the bracket that comes with it is mostly useless. I guess I'll have to try to engineer something as i don't trust just clamping it on the end of the head pipe.

New horn arrive and tweets when the button is pushed. Indian horn sent to the trash. Air cleaner should be here late next week.

The clear fuel hose is yellow and pretty brittle so I'll try to source replacement. I have black I can use but I dig the look of the clear and like being able to see it if has fuel or not.

Not sure what I'll do about the decompressor cable. If i can't fix it I'll just manually push the valve open for now.

[pushrod]

Ethanol in the gas destroys most tank liners over time and you have a mess to deal with all over again. If you have the inside of the tank clean I would leave it that way and just add a very small amount of quailty 2 stroke oil to about every other tankful.  Works for me.

[ddavidv]

Have to seal it. Has a pinhole in the chrome area and I suspect more will follow.

[ace.cafe]

For the rear exhaust bracket, I just got a piece of aluminum flat stock and cut and drilled it.

[ddavidv]

Okay, this carb again...

I'll be trying to start it tomorrow. There is no 'choke' on this thing, right? Is the only adjustment air/fuel? While I assume it is set to run at least half-decently with all the other bodges done to this thing I want to be prepared to tune it if need be.

[ddavidv]

For the rear exhaust bracket, I just got a piece of aluminum flat stock and cut and drilled it.

I've not been able to envision a solution. The Emgo has a stud pretty far towards the exit. It is decidedly out past the rear shock mount. To get an attachment to the frame would be a long, multi-bend Rube Goldberg affair.  It's a $58 muffler so I've just clamped it on for now. If it falls off, well...

I tried searching Google images as I'm sure someone somewhere has used one before but came up empty.

[ace.cafe]

I don't know what to say about that carb. I never used one. They used to sell a kit here at CMW years ago, and there must be someone still here that has one.

I've not been able to envision a solution. The Emgo has a stud pretty far towards the exit. It is decidedly out past the rear shock mount. To get an attachment to the frame would be a long, multi-bend Rube Goldberg affair.  It's a $58 muffler so I've just clamped it on for now. If it falls off, well...

I tried searching Google images as I'm sure someone somewhere has used one before but came up empty.

It must be a long Emgo. We always used the short megaphone.
On my old Ducati which had a long muffler, I ran a bracket from the top shock mount down to the muffler.

[Bilgemaster]

As far as that chokeless (?) carb goes, none of the Amal Concentrics on my two Nortons had a choke. I don't think I had one on my BSA Victor 441 single either. The choke slides, handlebar lever and so forth had long been removed by previous owners by the time they came my way. I gather this was commonly done. I never missed it. A little gas while stomping it over and they always fired right up. I presume you'll get the hang of yours too.

As for the exhaust bracket issue, could we see a couple of pix of the area in question?

[Adrian II]

If it's one of the JRC Keihin copies, shouldn't it have a plunger cold start system rather than an Amal type choke ? Lift the plunger to start, push it back down with the engine running.

http://victorylibrary.com/brit/jrc-c.htm

[ddavidv]

Finished up, just waiting for the fuel tank sealer to dry.

On the muffler the stud for the bracket is almost directly in line with the rear axle.

[Bilgemaster]

A support to the muffler clamp bolt, maybe using a longer bolt and spacer at the clamp, coming down from where the fender brace is attached, under the side panel, might do the trick handily. My Norton's "stubbies" aren't even supported, have been happy that way for years and years, and your muffler isn't much larger than them. It's not like you're hauling along some massive steroid-injected OEM baloney zeppelin, like me. A small length of copper tubing mashed at the ends, drilled, and painted black would do the job fine.

[Adrian II]

Something like this comes with a suitable bracket. Item number 232547275809 on ebay.

A.

[ddavidv]

Red Kote can says there shouldn't be any odor left but I can't smell it unless I stick my nose right at the opening. Fukit.
https://youtu.be/qxRuFw1gUf0
However, we are not without issues.
The first is the thing idles way too fast. I tinkered with the throttle cable to no avail. Turned the black knob on the carb that I think only is a up/down knob for cold starts. Spun the mixture screw around a bit. Nothing changed it. I'm afraid to let it idle much at the revs it's turning with fresh parts in there. Since the thing came in pieces with the carb just hanging from the cable I have no idea what it is supposed to look like. Does this opening appear too big? I have it adjusted down as far as the slide/cable seems to allow.

The other problem is a :doh. The thing was pissing ATF out of the primary case. I thought it was the joint between the crankcase and the inner primary cover. My camera indicates otherwise.

Is that a crack running horizontally? Whatever it is, much disassembly will be needed.
Damaged from a blown up sprag clutch maybe?

[ddavidv]

Today with a fresh perspective (after spending the morning at a massive local car show) I figured out the throttle cable was the problem. It is routed along the spine of the frame and I had zip tied it (loosely) along with the harness. Well with the gas tank installed it apparently was pinching it to some extent. I removed one of the zip ties which seemed to free it up.

I tried to start it but no dice. So I pulled the enrichening knob and it fired off...and idled properly.

Well that was easy. So on on to the primary case. Took apart everything I had put together again (clutch, alternator, chain). The inner case cover was pretty stuck on but nothing the good old plastic dead blow hammer couldn't solve. I get the thing apart and don't see a crack. What I also don't see is half the gasket for the inner cover. There's SOME there but none where the leak was occurring. Another PO/bad mechanic fail!
While I was in there I removed the sprag clutch and gears for the electric start. Having the sprag clutch in my hand and understanding how it works I can see why everyone told me to remove it. It's like a baby grenade full of shrapnel just waiting to go off.
I'm still in the process of putting it all back together but hope tomorrow to take it on it's first actual ride.

[Bilgemaster]

Excellent! We're rooting fer ya!

[ddavidv]

Success!
Had it out twice today. First challenge was it wouldn't start. Troubleshooting revealed it wasn't getting gas to the carb. Uh-oh. My paranoia about the tank liner began to bubble. Removed the tank, pulled the petcock...nope, not clogged. Huh. Put it back on, no fuel with the tank mounted. I tried reserve. Fired right up.
 
Pro tip:  make sure you have enough gas in the tank to feed the non-reserve portion.

Rode it for several miles. Several observations:
The brakes are horrible.
My Emgo muffler is TOO LOUD.
Upshift like you mean it.
Downshift with just a feather touch or you'll get a false neutral.
Downshifting with a false neutral and no engine braking will really illustrate just how rubbish the brakes are.
Vibrations--a feature to let you know it is still running.
Turn signals don't work. Again.
It's weeping a bit of ATF. Not sure if primary cover seal or if it's coming from the shifter.
My pegs are set at two different heights, which sucks.
What the hell is this kick starter doing where my heel should be?
Why is there a 5th gear? 4th is terrifying enough.
Kill switch doesn't kill.
Ride is pretty stiff, particularly the rear. Is the preload adjustable? (I forgot to look)
The duckbill...is it really shitting that much oil onto my chain? I have black specks all over the left side of the wheel.
The barrel doesn't leak. I find this astounding.
What a horrible motorcycle by today's standards. What fun it is to ride though!

Went to the gas station to put gas in it. Number of people who asked about it in the span of pumping two gallons:  2.

[Seipgam]

The duckbill...is it really shitting that much oil onto my chain? I have black specks all over the left side of the wheel.

This should subside after you ride it a bit. 
Make sure when you leave the bike overnight or longer to leave the engine at TDC, if not the some oil will make it's way to the crank case.  Most of this oil will be picked up by the scavenge pump but some will spat out through the duckbill.
To leave it at on near TDC, kick it until compression, decompress it then move the kicker back a small amount (about 5 min. if it were a clock hand) and this should be pretty close.
This is about right for mine so I presume it will be the same for most.

Geoff.

[Bilgemaster]

I expect that a lot of the shortcomings you describe, such as lousy braking, sloppy shifting, and so forth may markedly improve after you've put a few hundred miles on her and blown out some of the cobwebs. A quick readjustment of the clutch and brakes might also be in order then.

Try running some nice fresh straight GL4 (NOT GL5!) 90 weight gear lube, which you can often find in the boating section of stores. If it looks halfway decent, whatever you drain out can be filtered with a coffee filter or similar and used to lube the drive chain really well. I just slop on a wee bit after each ride along the easy-to-reach lower run of the chain with an old chip brush, and in the 6,000 miles I've put on her, I've only had to take up those snaily wheel adjusters one notch.

In general, the more you ride, the more limber and sweeter she'll get. Her quirks will become 2nd nature to you, even somehow endearing, as you build up a special sort of "muscle memory" to her. It's a lot more "equestrian" an experience than piloting some soulless UJM.

[ddavidv]

OMG...as if I haven't fixed enough PO bodges...

Thanks for the above comments. I tried to start making 'adjustments' tonight on some of the irritations. First the foot pegs. No matter how I try they won't get equal side to side. Something must be bent.



It's possible I installed these opposite of what they were originally as there is no way to explain the right side being bent forward. Not a crisis, just annoying.

But on to the subject of the front brake. I've ridden several other old motorcycles not known for great brakes. I rode a Benelli once that had a fabulous rear brake which was great, because the front one was near useless. This seemed worse to me. At a  minimum I wanted to lessen the travel of the hand lever as it got too close to the grip to suit me. Despite having spent a lot of time tinkering with it before I started down the path of loosening nuts and threading rods, spinning the front wheel and being ever more perplexed by how it didn't seem to work right. And finally, eureka!



I took the adjustment linking rod (15) completely off. Then I found out the bottom pivot (7) moves very little before the shoe hits the drum. The upper lever ( needs to travel probably close to an inch before I feel contact inside the hub. Well that can't be right...that means I'm only using half my brakes. No wonder this thing won't stop! In the illustration it appears the upper lever is serrated; should this be removed and rotated to make up the difference? Do I just undo the visible nut? A cursory tug on that nut applies the brakes and didn't feel like it was keen to let loose.

But the real joy is that the little trunion (17) has no threads. Totally hogged out. Which explains why the upper cam always wants to stick--despite the fact it isn't actually doing anything inside the drum.

 

[Arizoni]

You might want to use the forums "Search" feature.
Put in, adjusting front brake into the subject box.  Then, select the "Choose a board to search in" and click on "Bullet Iron Barrel" then poke the search button.

There are hundreds of posts about adjusting and setting up the dual cam brakes and I'm sure you will find some posts that will tell you exactly how to fix yours.

[Bilgemaster]

[...Snip!]

Thanks for the above comments. I tried to start making 'adjustments' tonight on some of the irritations. First the foot pegs. No matter how I try they won't get equal side to side. Something must be bent.



It's possible I installed these opposite of what they were originally as there is no way to explain the right side being bent forward. Not a crisis, just annoying.

[Snip!...]

It looks to me like you did swap the footrests and/or supports, and what is more, that the one currently on the right, missing the tip of its rubber boot, was very likely bent during a drop while it was still on the left, judging by the angle. The drop's probably what tore off the tip of the rubber. Some mapgas or propane torch heat, a vise and a little persuasion with a stout pipe (say a two or three foot length of iron gas pipe or steel fencing post or similar) with maybe a few tender blows with a big ass hammer might get her back into proper shape. If it snaps, well eBay is your friend. For example, here's a pair of nice used supports off a 2004 that'll do the trick for about $20 delivered to your door.

[Adrian II]

Wrong item, B.M.!

They're the passenger/pillion footrest mounts in that ebay listing, not the rider's foot rests.

A.

[Adrian II]

Try THESE:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2004-Royal-Enfield-Bullet-DRIVER-FOOTPEG-BRACKET-LEFT-RIGHT-/312323839019?vxp=mtr&hash=item48b7f3942b

A.

[Bilgemaster]

Try THESE:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2004-Royal-Enfield-Bullet-DRIVER-FOOTPEG-BRACKET-LEFT-RIGHT-/312323839019?vxp=mtr&hash=item48b7f3942b

A.

Sorry 'bout that! Right you are! I really gotta cut down on that glue sniffing.

[mrunderhill1975a]

The foot pegs mount to a hex shaft, I believe.  If you rotate the foot peg one face (60 degrees) you should be able to find a location where the foot pegs are perpendicular to the bike and fold up and back at a 60 degree angle.  If that does not work, they are bent and map gas is in order.

[ddavidv]

I didn't get to the pegs tonight. I continued working on the front brake. Greased the pivots, reset everything and test rode again. Brakes are still awful and--hooray--now they are sticking. 
The manual states the lever should be at a 90 degree angle to the cable. Mine certainly is not.

The cable where it attaches to the fork is adjusted nearly all the way downward. When I pull on the cable and apply the brake then release it the handle/cable does not return fully. If I push the hand lever outward it will rest fully retracted.
At this point I'm suspicious of the cable itself. It has an odd feel to it, like when I really tug on the brakes it almost feels like it stretches.

The other pisser is the shifter seal isn't leaking. It's actually leaking from behind the rear primary cover. Aaaargh! I just had that all apart! I'm sure it just started since the last repair as I disturbed the universe by removing it.

My Chinese air cleaner came today and I installed it. The bike doesn't seem to idle well as a result. Do I adjust the air/fuel mixture to compensate?

[Bilgemaster]

Could it be you have the wrong length or type of cable on there? Maybe some PO's make-do replacement? Attached is a quick candid midnight in the mist shot of my 2005's front brake assembly. Aside from needing to lightly "skim" it dry when I first set off after a good downpour by very lightly holding the lever as she moves along for a few hundred feet just to warm up the shoes and drums a little so they aren't too "grabby", my front brake is tip-top, and its actuating arm is indeed perpendicular to the cable, as you say. Mine also seems to have some sort of wear indicator arrow doodad at the arm pivot yours lacks, but I shouldn't think that crucial or even relevant to your situation.

Hang in there, man! It's sounding like you're almost there!

[Davross45]

I bought a 350 bullet with the same TLS front brake as yours in April
I'm no expert but I can see that brakes is miles out of adjustment
The shoes are not contacting the drum at the same time, that's why you are getting the spongy feeling.
I got an acceptable brake that actually compressors the front forks and almost hauls you up by
Stripping the shoes out, cleaning and lightly greasing the pivot points.
Then I adjusted the pivot arms so they were both parallel.
And the Shoes were contacting the drum with the bottom arm approaching 90 degrees
The top trunion on mine was drilled through with a small lock nut the bottom is a left hand thread.
Back the link bar off
Adjust the brake so the bottom shoe is just touching the drum (hear it)
Then get someone to apply the brake and adjust the link bar so the top shoe touches at the same time.
If the brake is still poor, strip again and dress the visible high spots on both shoes.
It sounds complicated but it's straight forward once everything is laid out.
It took about a week of on and off trial and error but my brake works now.

[ddavidv]

I have it adjusted that both shoes contact the drum at the same time. What you see in the pic is how things wound up after doing that.

So...can I just remove the lever from the bottom and change it's location to make it 90 deg to the cable coming down?

Of course if I do that the cable may not reach?

Other question:  a friend critiqued my axle mounting/clamping. He told me I should bottom out the top 'gap' then draw the lower one in. I've been drawing them down evenly. Opinion on who is right?

[Adrian II]

With Davross45's instructions in mind, your operating levers should be acting as two sides of a parallelogram together with the linking rod, the brake cams have splined shafts to allow for fine(-ish!) adjustment!

Hitchcocks' notes explain the whole drilled trunnion thing for making adjustment easier.

https://www.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/pictures/content414/front_brake_overhaul_16-08-17.pdf

Cable too short? don't forget the lower cable adjuster on the fork leg, if the cable has insufficient inner left with the handlebar lever adjuster and the fork leg adjuster screwed fully in, it could be the wrong one. Either replace with a new one the correct length, or if it's still in good condition, and if you are REALLY careful, you could shorten the outer cable a little, but don't damage the inner cable at all, or else you will have to buy a new one anyway.

Ref the front axle clamps, I have always tried to even out the gap.

A.

[ace.cafe]

The drilled trunnion is ruined and must be replaced. The likely reason for the sticking is that Hitchcock modification removes any positive retraction of the upper brake shoe by the linkage.

Fix the brakes to be centralized and adjusted properly. No need for any drilled trunnion.

[ddavidv]

Ace, interesting take. I'm one who is loathe to alter what factory engineers have done. And the upper cam did do exactly as you described before though I'm not sure it is currently the culprit.

I'm probably just going to order the trunion and new cables (you may recall the decompressor cable is non-functional). Too many unknowns with the current setup and it's starting to frustrate me.

I also feel I should clarify a generic thing on the brakes. Rest assured I am not comparing the Bullet's brakes to anything else/modern I currently have. I've ridden several 1960s British bikes with drum brakes and while they are not spectacular they will stop the bike with authority. These do not work. I could stop quicker throwing out an anchor.

I mention this because I was just in a discussion with a guy who felt the brakes on his modern Triumph Bonneville were inadequate. I own one also and they are certainly good brakes but not outstanding compared to some other brands. Braking quality is highly variable to what you are used to. I'm confident the brakes on my RE are capable of adequate ability but they aren't currently there.

[ddavidv]

BTW, curious minds and all that...anyone know what the 'S' and 'O' cast into the drum refer to?

[mrunderhill1975a]

"S" means "shoes are OK".  "O" means "Ooooh...shiiiiiiiiiii***!". I better get some new shoes.

[ddavidv]

Curses...Hitchcock's is out of stock of the LH threaded trunion.

[Arizoni]

I don't know but it the lower brake cam has a splined shaft like Adrian II says, it looks like the arm is installed one tooth off of where it should be.  By installing it clockwise 1 tooth it might be perpendicular to the cable like the book says it should be.

[ddavidv]

I'm going to try moving it. I also figured I could put a lock nut on the inboard side of the trunion as well to help with the return.

[Bilgemaster]

All these revelations of "drilled trunion" being "ruined" and other molestations of those brakes, aside from making me think of taking a brief break of my own in my bunk, make me wonder if grabbing this complete 2004 front brake plate assembly for just $36.95 with free delivery might not be a quick and simple solution to your woes. It's even got the shoes, which don't look half bad. I mean, who can say what other "improvements" may have been wrought by the PO to that troublesome brake? Just slap on that seemingly unmolested eBay one, a fresh cable, and go for a damned ride, say I. In fact, it's a gorgeous day, so that's where I'm off to right now.

P.S. Ask the vendor nicely, and I'll bet they'd throw in the original cable.

[ddavidv]

"Seemingly unmolested" is the key phrase there. 
Much of my bike was in that category when I purchased it!

[ddavidv]

I tinkered with it again last night, repositioning the levers and adding a inner locknut to the drilled out trunion. Yet to be tested but the brake lever feel is completely different...in a good way!

[ace.cafe]

Itf you haven't done it yet, see if you can loosen up the brake plate center nut and apply the brake hard and hold it on while then tightening it up. This centers the shoes.

Also, if shoes are new, put an arc on the leading edges with a hand file, or else it will take forever for them to bed in and make full contact.

[ddavidv]

One step forward, multiple steps back...but the brakes are fixed!

It only took four attempts, two sets on instructions, internet coaching, staring at photos on the web and a colossal amount of cursing but they work...well, pretty well considering their reputation. It will actually stop now without making my sphincter pucker.

I retorqued the head bolts (successful) and stripped one of the valve cover studs (the opposite of successful). This latter thing really cheeses me off because I never strip threaded fasteners anymore. I acquired that 'feel' decades ago and can tell when something is starting to go wrong. This? Not even snug and I could tell. Pulled it out with the threads attached to the stud.

Dammit.

And the bloody right turn signals aren't working again. And now the clutch has decided it wants to slip.

However, after my test ride and satisfaction with the brakes I've decided to call today a WIN as I have surmounted a huge hill getting it to stop. Hopefully the clutch is merely an adjustment issue...or it has lost far more ATF weeping through that shifter seal than I thought.

[ace.cafe]

ALL nuts on the top of the head, such as rocker block nuts and rocker cover nuts only get 5 ft-lbs torque, no matter what any workshop manual says.
Head stud nuts get 20 ft-lbs, not the 24 the manual says.

These figures are well tested and very accurate numbers that will hold all the respective items securely without pulling the studs out. It is extremely important to not pull out the studs because the alloy is soft and there isn't enough material to securely hold a Timesert and a Helicoil won't hold either. You might be lucky and get a thread repair to hold, but very often they will pull out too.

The moral of the story is to use my torque figures carefully and hope for the best. I have a LOT of experience in this area, and you would be very well advised to heed this. I have seen iron barrel Bullet heads that we could not repair, and I worked in one of the most advanced racing shops in the country when we built our Fireball engines. We could work miracles, but when the heads go soft and start pulling studs, it can get very bad.

[ddavidv]

Snidal book says 8 ft lbs. "Buy the Snidal book" everyone said. "That is all you need" they said.

Too late now. So I'm basically f*cked? No way to get that stud back in?

[ace.cafe]

Snidal book says 8 ft lbs. "Buy the Snidal book" everyone said. "That is all you need" they said.

Too late now. So I'm basically f*cked? No way to get that stud back in?

The cover studs have a little more meat around them, and you can try a helicoil or Timesert.

We have tried everything conceivable, and it all comes down to how soft the alloy in the head has gotten. It loses temper during overheating that happens from previous owners.

So, you might get lucky. It is worth a try.

Snidey just copied service manual tq specs, and they have been known to be too much for a long time, but Enfield never updates or corrects their literature.

We have built over 50 performance Bullets and consulted on a lot more, and we have found from real world experience that downrating tq values on the things I mentioned work reliably, and do not pull threads. I have fixed a lot of these heads, but there were some that we just could not stop the threads from pulling out no matter what we tried.

Also, since it is a cover stud, you can try using a sealer on the gasket, and it might very well seal without that one nut tightened down. The others might hold it well enough. The rocker blocks can't do that, though, so be real careful with those.

[Seipgam]

If it's only a rocker cover stud a little JB Weld might be sufficient?

Geoff.

[ddavidv]

I was wondering if that might work. We'll see if it leaks (much) before getting overly concerned. The stud grabs just a smidge so it is currently in the head at least making things look complete but has almost no tension on it.

Jiggled wires and found the short in the turn signals. One of the wires in the rear mudguard had the insulation worn through by the tire, it appears. Prior to my 'rebuilding' that part of the harness I need to point out. My shit was tucked in the retainers properly! The lack of a fuse in the system was actually helpful in this case. Got to find it with cute little sparks. :lol2

The primary leak is a bit puzzling. I was pretty convinced it was a shifter seal but now I'm uncertain. ATF collects in the gap between the primary case halves and drips from the joint bottom center. When it's sitting if I wipe it off it stays dry. Once I ride it it gets damp and drips a not-insignificant amount on the floor when I stop. I wonder if I've lost enough that it is causing clutch slippage?

I got the idle adjusted by making it a bit more rich now that it has a proper air filter. I'll run it a bit and check the plug again.

Have yet to figure out the 'easy' cold starting. I *think* it may like a bit of throttle. Remember mine has a PWK carb conversion. I've tried pulling the enrichment knob on the top but it doesn't seem to help. Once it fires it will stay running with a bit of throttle until it warms, then relaxes into a nice John Deere dug, dug, dug. Not having a functional decompression cable is a PITA though. Been doing it manually with my gloved hand.

The Emgo muffler has GOT to go. Makes it sound more like a lawn implement than a motorcycle.

[ace.cafe]

Only fill the primary up to the bottom of the fill hole.
If it still leaks, put some heavy grease on the large rubber seal on the perimeter of the primary cover. If that fails, look at the inner primary clutch shaft seal or shifter seal. Do not try to crank down the cover nut or it will warp the cover and leak worse.

If it is already warped a little, sand it back to flat on a piece of glass.

[ddavidv]

Another test ride last night. Clutch seems to only slip when cold. After a good warm up period no slippage (I have plenty of hills around me to test on). I know there is some adjustment available on the transmission end but the Sidal manual makes it sound fiddly and easy to make worse rather than better. Tempted to just leave it.

Confirmed for certain it is my inboard shift seal leaking and not the primary case joint. Bugger. I'm an expert on tearing that side apart now though.

Rear suspension is a bit harsh and the preload is set near the top. Should I bother trying to lower it? This has a solo seat so no passenger will ever be astride it (I removed the rear pegs as well)?

[ddavidv]

Are the speedometers on these not known for accuracy? Mine seems rather optimistic. I find it hard to believe I'm going 60 mph on the roads around here.

[ace.cafe]

Are the speedometers on these not known for accuracy? Mine seems rather optimistic. I find it hard to believe I'm going 60 mph on the roads around here.

The speedo accuracy varies, but it is common for them to read about 10mph high.

[Seipgam]

My speedo reads about 15kmh over actual speed, checked it with a free GPS speedo app on my phone and made a couple of marks with a permanent marker on the chrome bezel at true 60, 80 and 100kmh.

Geoff.

[Bilgemaster]

Are the speedometers on these not known for accuracy? Mine seems rather optimistic. I find it hard to believe I'm going 60 mph on the roads around here.

Enfield speedos are indeed notoriously inaccurate, which explains why speeds reported in this Forum so often include the qualifier "indicated".

[tooseevee]

Enfield speedos are indeed notoriously inaccurate, which explains why speeds reported in this Forum so often include the qualifier "indicated".

      I've got a Sigma ready to go on the Enfield just for that purpose. The trigger is all set up, I just need to get my tire circumference measured.

       I put a Sigma on my last harley because the refurbished FX speedo lost its mind over 55. The Sigmas are very accurate speed indicators and do not waver or lag or hunt as the little el cheapo electronic tachs do - all you must be sure of is accurate tire circumference measurement.

[ddavidv]

10 mph sounds about right from my 'visual asphalt speeding past' reference.    This bike is (laughably) not fast. Reminds me a bit of my dad's Honda Trail 90 though it is capable of more than 45 mph.

I've either mastered the gearbox or it has fixed itself. Only one false neutral my last outing.

I got the plate for it today (I've been illegally motoring about with my Triumph Tiger's tag). So vast is my confidence in this machine I coughed up two years of licensing instead of one. This will no doubt cause it to burst into a ball of flame and spew it's innards across the pavement shortly. 

[Bilgemaster]

[...Snip!]

I got the plate for it today (I've been illegally motoring about with my Triumph Tiger's tag). So vast is my confidence in this machine I coughed up two years of licensing instead of one. This will no doubt cause it to burst into a ball of flame and spew it's innards across the pavement shortly. 

Thing is, unlike more utilitarian "appliance bikes" with no more evident soul than a disposable lighter, Enfields clearly all have their own abundant individual personalities, quirks and even destinies. What'll start one first kick will flood another. One may adore burbling along at one speed, while another will begin frantically shedding her bolts there. I briefly described what the Native Americans called this "Manitou" or "mechanical-being soul" in an earlier posting..  Suffice it to say, that your gesture of a fullest 2 year commitment will be sensed by the Manitou and should bode well for coming to terms with your new partner...unless, that is,  you've somehow stumbled upon and revived the motive Bullet equivalent of Tiffany, the episodically psychotic and abused stripper, who never knew a good thing, and doesn't want to. Sweet or sour, you can count on continuing to have your commitment tested from time to time. Mine pops a clutch or a throttle cable, both times rather considerately in sight of my door after a long lovely ride through the hinterlands. Yours may murderously fling a clutch plate at you like Odd Job in Goldfinger. It's all part of the living adventure! If you didn't wanna play you shoulda got a nice tame and obedient Honda Rebel.

[ddavidv]

Bilgemaster, please never stop posting. I love reading your flowery prose. 

Machines that break down within easy retrieval distance of home base or fail within my driveway are typically given a pass. One that strands me far from home without warning is another thing entirely. Though these are inanimate objects (supposedly) I've found this criteria to serve me well over the years. Problem children are ejected from the garage and replaced with more cooperative residents.

My favorite tale of the nature is a '65 F100 I purchased for the princely sum of $200 back in the late 1980s. My belief that age and cosmetics have nothing to do with reliability was proven by this wretched junkyard refugee. Provided fluids are contained within and bolts appropriately tightened there is little difference in function with a device younger and prettier. With this in mind I traveled some 4 or 5 hours from home with a trailer to retrieve a project car purchase.

Climbing multiple grades to and from the great city of Pittsburgh on the PA turnpike did result in some consumption of liquids of the lubricating variety but these were easily replenished. It rained about half the trip and I detected a subtle wandering feel in the steering but dismissed it as crappy tires and very wet roads. Upon reaching home (and after dropping off car and trailer) I pulled up, turned the wheel to park against the curb as I lived on a slight hill, and heard a distinct metallic 'klunk'. Investigation revealed that the outer tie rod had inexplicably lost it's retaining nut and the rod had dropped from the spindle. One can only imagine the thrill that would have generated coming down a PA mountain...in the rain...towing a 3000 lb car on a trailer with no auxiliary brakes.

Such was the 'wisdom' of my youth at the time to rely on a truck constructed the same year as myself, yet it got me safely home only to collapse within a dozen steps of my toolbox.

On our last outing the Enfield provided ample warning that it was displeased with the level of fuel in the tank, a level I had just reviewed as 'sufficient'. An easy flip to Reserve and all remained well with our relationship.

[Bilgemaster]

Thanks for the kudos! Some retired geezers whittle, I fuss around with postings to obscure vehicular or sailing forums. That F100 deserved to be kept awhile. I presume you patched her up, having eked out that last mile to get you and the trailer home as a fine tow beast should. How long did it carry on afterwards, I wonder? Surely you don't still have it, do you?

As for fuel, I'm just as anal retentively obsessive with what goes into my Enfield's fuel tank as its lubricants: It's on a steady diet of the ethanol-free 89 octane good stuff, with a dash of Marvel Mystery Oil (maybe an ounce or two per tankful). There's also a bit of Sta-Bil 360 Marine in there for its storage in a shed. I get the ethanol-free in fuel runs every couple-few months a couple of counties south of here, about a half hour away, which is the closest it's available. I then write to my congressman and senators after each and every run to bitch about having to do it and not being given the option to purchase real pure unadulterated fuel any closer to home just because some corn fed galoots are first in line for that whole Presidential kabuki theater and exact "The Ethanol Pledge" from every wannabe POTUS. Ethanol is the devil. But whatever spew you keep in that tank, it's usually wise to keep it nice and full, since that minimizes the amount of air, and therefore water vapor, that can condense in your tank and then either bond up with that hydrophilic ethanol to make a nice cloggy snot to goob up your carb, or just gather in the bottom of the tank, below even the Reserve tap, to munch little rusty pinholes down in there. Speaking of which, that Reserve is likely to throw open the gate for all sorts of nasty particulate bottom-dwelling crudlets best kept away from your carb. You'd do well to use it only in a real pinch, such as fleeing during Zombie Apocalypse level emergencies or escaping an impending David Hasselhoff concert. Best just to always keep her topped up.

How ethanol appears in your carb jet

[ddavidv]

I'm as opposed to ethanol being forced upon us as any Libertarian should be. I did watch this video last night and found his take interesting. This fella is never afraid to voice his opinion about something.
https://youtu.be/2peeE3hv5Jk

As for the mighty F100 I did keep it for some time afterward. A homely beast, my folks were less than delighted at it being parked outside their residence.


It eventually got sold to a friend who painted it with house paint and subsequently sold it for around $600 if memory serves. All I ever did to it was rebuild the carb and throw plugs in it. And replenish the oil that vanished from the crankcase.

Such was the delight of that reliable machine that I later got another which I enjoyed for ten years.


I was using it to tow my race car to the track and what was once 'charming' began to grate on me. I sold it as it required some rust repair and the paint was a good ten footer. I lament somewhat letting that one go. The 'modern' truck that replaced it (1993 model) isn't at all endearing. As I look toward possibly giving up the BMW race machine I think I'd go back into the 1970s for a replacement truck. The 1960s models that I prefer have climbed to a price point I no longer wish to play in.

[Bilgemaster]

I reckon that prices on "collectible vehicles", apart from being now buoyed by the Internet, which places every rust heap "project" into a national if not international market instead of the back pages of 'Hemmings Motor News' or the 'Thrifty Nickel Advertiser' tend to follow a trend of "What was desirable to kids in school 40 or so years ago?" Now that those kids of yore have a little disposable income in their late 50s, 60s and 70s, and the kids are out of the nest, they want and can afford those objects of youthful desire. For example, for the past many years '70s muscle cars...ANY "muscle car"...have been a hot "investment" (That's what you tell the wife), but give it a decade or so, and those prices will begin softening as their owners lapse into their own stool-softening Purple Metamucil Haze. Inertia and increasing scarcity will carry them only so far before the next generations starts geezing and surfing for first generation Tesla's or something.

Actually, that's not entirely true. Ask around your friends with teenagers: This new crop of Younguns coming up is generally nowhere near as driving or vehicle obsessed as we were. I waited maybe a quarter nanosecond before being able to legally apply for my learner's permit and then did the driving test precisely 2 weeks later, just as soon as I could. In contrast, my oldest kid had a learner's permit for 2 years and only bothered taking the full test because the learner's was set to expire. My daughter is 18, and has yet to show the least interest in even getting even a learner's permit. So, there's some sea change in the offing. Many kids nowadays just don't care if they can drive or not. The same goes with sailing. Marinas are starting to look like AARP early bird luncheons. I suppose those kids are just too busy seeking the Sacred Toothbrush of Mordor or whatever the hell they're doing online in the basement. As long as they stay off my damned lawn.

[ddavidv]

Your observations echo many in the collector car field. You can buy nice driver Model A Fords for less than the price of a new Bonneville. The cost of restoring a lot of old cars isn't worth the final value.

Pickups are a funny market all to themselves. EVERYONE loves old trucks. My wife, who is generally disinterested in most things that grace my garage, loved 'Big Red'. Old trucks aren't especially rare but interest/demand is so high it keeps the pricing up. Also compare to the cost of new trucks (absurd) the old stuff is a bargain if you just want an occasional hauler, as I do.

Young 'uns don't have as much interest in vehicles or driving as we did but they are not completely immune. Those who do have an interest are rabidly so. They may like the styling of the old stuff we grew up with but would rather have the latest whiz-bang turbo Ecoboost V6 swapped into it than suffer the pushrod antiquity topped with a fuel toilet. I have been encouraged by several young fellas on YouTube who have been taken by the 'Roadkill' mentality of resurrecting dead cars as a challenge. Junkyard Digs channel is one of note, discovered by my following his attempts to give life to a 1965 truck like mine that even I would not have bothered with.

[ddavidv]

At a swap meet today picked up a new in the bag signal flasher. Installed in the bike...and it doesn't flash. Light stays on steady. Put back my car flasher and they blink but slowly. 

Also picked up a sexy exhaust header heat dissapator that will do absolutely nothing but it was nice to be able to find something in the pile of parts that actually fit my bike.

[ddavidv]

Predictably the front fork seals appear to be weeping. Do I want the kit with the spacers and clips or can I get by with just the seals?

[mrunderhill1975a]

"...spacers and clips... ?"
I generally just get the seals unless the spacers and clips are broken.  You won't really know until you pull off the fork legs.

[Bilgemaster]

Have you tried just cleaning 'em up a bit, or are they really gushing? Here's one of several YouTube how-to videos, this one using a cut out chunk of an old juice bottle: https://youtu.be/1P2MSpMhfNs

(Too lazy to hyperlink properly...certainly too lazy to rebuild my forks in prime riding weather, unless they start squirting me in the eyeballs)

You haven't been pulling wheelies, have you?

[ddavidv]

No gushing. One is 'damp' and the other is leaving 'trails'. I'm not overly worried about it and will ride as-is for the summer, just want to get the parts while I'm putting another order together.

[ddavidv]

I've ordered a 'proper' muffler and some other bits from Hitchcock's. I am quite the fan of their 'clearance' pages. As this bike is not perfect it is a good candidate for 'substandard' parts. The seat was a 'second' because it had an odd mark in the leather grain. I have to stare at the seat to even see it. The muffler is an English made one with some sort of cosmetic defect. Forty quid less...sounds perfect!

I've been riding it around learning it's quirks. Starting has become pretty easy, often with one kick. I've learned to crank the throttle more to get actual momentum. The engine has such good torque characteristics I've not been winding it out plus it gets so buzzy but it seems quite eager to be wound out.

The clutch will slip when cold and sometimes even hot if I really get on the juice. Someone suggested I sandblast the metal discs? Would fiddling with what sounds like a fussy adjustment perhaps help?

Weeps a bit of oil out of the nut for the valve tappet cover. I don't recall there being a washer or gasket there. Engine seems to stay dry otherwise.

There is a lopped off ? hose on the right side, top of crankcase inboard toward the distributor. I'm guessing this was part of a breather that went to my missing air cleaner box. It's not spewing anything, just leaves a bit of dampness to collect dirt. Leave it alone or ?

[ace.cafe]

I've ordered a 'proper' muffler and some other bits from Hitchcock's. I am quite the fan of their 'clearance' pages. As this bike is not perfect it is a good candidate for 'substandard' parts. The seat was a 'second' because it had an odd mark in the leather grain. I have to stare at the seat to even see it. The muffler is an English made one with some sort of cosmetic defect. Forty quid less...sounds perfect!

I've been riding it around learning it's quirks. Starting has become pretty easy, often with one kick. I've learned to crank the throttle more to get actual momentum. The engine has such good torque characteristics I've not been winding it out plus it gets so buzzy but it seems quite eager to be wound out.

The clutch will slip when cold and sometimes even hot if I really get on the juice. Someone suggested I sandblast the metal discs? Would fiddling with what sounds like a fussy adjustment perhaps help?

Weeps a bit of oil out of the nut for the valve tappet cover. I don't recall there being a washer or gasket there. Engine seems to stay dry otherwise.

There is a lopped off ? hose on the right side, top of crankcase inboard toward the distributor. I'm guessing this was part of a breather that went to my missing air cleaner box. It's not spewing anything, just leaves a bit of dampness to collect dirt. Leave it alone or ?

If the clutch doesn't drag, then the plates and adjustments are probably okay. You can get 3 heavy duty clutch springs to help it hold. 6 could be used, but that makes it hard to pull the clutch, and 3 at every other spring usually works.
Also, using ATF helps clutch hold because it has friction modifiers for holding clutch linings in automatic transmissions, and engine oil does not. ATF has sufficient lubrication qualities for the primary chain, and it is thinner so it doesn't have the warming up time needed for engine oil. I always use it. If the clutch still slips, try Type F ATF which has grabbier characteristics.
If the clutch drags, check the steel plates for flatness and renew any warped ones.

Do not hold the clutch in at stop lights or it may overheat and warp the steel discs. Use neutral at stop lights.

Tappet cover nut should have a fiber washer under it.

[tooseevee]

The engine has such good torque characteristics I've not been winding it out plus it gets so buzzy but it seems quite eager to be wound out.

Weeps a bit of oil out of the nut for the valve tappet cover. I don't recall there being a washer or gasket there. Engine seems to stay dry otherwise.

          Don't lug it staying in too high a gear for the speed and load.. You'll be sorry. Rev it up a little.

           My '08 tappet cover nut has an O-Ring. Take it off, clean it up, dry it all well, put it back on. Not too tight; you can crack the cover and then you're in "need a new one" territory.

            If it's a fiber washer, you may need to replace it. A real hardware store has little drawers in the back full of washers.

[Adrian II]

The muffler is an English made one with some sort of cosmetic defect. Forty quid less...sounds perfect!

Some of Hitchcocks' mufflers don't actually muffle a whole lot! 

A.

[ddavidv]

I'm running Type F fluid already. No clutch drag when stopped.

[ddavidv]

Unpacked the latest shipment from Hitchcock's which includes all new cables. The only one I really wanted was the decompressor but figured I should stock up as the originals will inevitably break.

I've never been able to get my decompressor to work as posted previously. I'm looking at the new cable...which looks exactly like the old cable. I'm starting to think I may not have assembled everything properly the last time. So, some help please.

Does the cable activate by pulling upward or pushing downward? I was going with the presumption it pushed down because the spring needs to be compressed. However I now don't see any way that would actually work. So pull up then? In which case I can't for the life of me figure out how this all should go together that it will work that way!



(spring not shown)
I didn't take it apart and this is pretty much how it looked when I got the bike.

[Bilgemaster]

Where's the rest of it? The parts that screw into the head and the valve itself? Put it all together outside of the bike and hook up the cable and all should become clear.

[Seipgam]

Google images of  Royal Enfield Decompressor Assembly  and you will see whats going on.

Geoff.

[mrunderhill1975a]

The cable pulls up, but since the Bowden tube (around the cable) stays the same length, it effectively pushes down on the metal disc and spring.  The valve is attached to the metal disc, so while the disc and spring are being pushed down, the valve is also pushed down thereby opening it.

[Arizoni]

Here's a view from Snidal's book.

[ddavidv]

The cable pulls up, but since the Bowden tube (around the cable) stays the same length, it effectively pushes down on the metal disc and spring.  The valve is attached to the metal disc, so while the disc and spring are being pushed down, the valve is also pushed down thereby opening it.

This is what I was thinking but when I had it together (like every photo I've found) when I pull the cable up nothing happens.
I've not been able to find any good photos of the cable routing. Does it go outside the fuel tank or 'inside' along the spine of the frame like the wiring harness, etc ?

[mrunderhill1975a]

If nothing happens when cable pulled, it would mean:
1)Nipple end of the cable not secured into the valve body (should slip into notch).
2)Bowden tube end not secured into the lever fitting or not secured into the "block" fitting. When tube secured into those fittings, the tube effectively "pushes" on the block and valve.
3) Bowden tube not long enough to engage the fitting in the lever or block end (basically, the wrong tube for the distance between block and lever).

[ddavidv]

Now for the latest on the decompressor cable...
My Hitchcock's cable is pretty much identical t what is on the bike aside from construction quality. Length, fittings, etc all match up. I didn't swap it out as a result. Put it all back together and just spent a lot of time gazing, tugging and trying to figure out what isn't happening.

My deducing led me to 'the cable is too long' which of course makes no sense with another cable that is known good and a match. The bowden cable simply doesn't stay in place. Peering more closely at things I think something may be amiss:




I can see a bit of threaded area where a screw or bolt may go. Am I looking at something broken off the handlebar control?

[tooseevee]

Now for the latest on the decompressor cable...
My Hitchcock's cable is pretty much identical t what is on the bike aside from construction quality. Length, fittings, etc all match up. I didn't swap it out as a result. Put it all back together and just spent a lot of time gazing, tugging and trying to figure out what isn't happening.

My deducing led me to 'the cable is too long' which of course makes no sense with another cable that is known good and a match. The bowden cable simply doesn't stay in place. Peering more closely at things I think something may be amiss:

I can see a bit of threaded area where a screw or bolt may go. Am I looking at something broken off the handlebar control?

     I don't claim to know exACTly what's wrong, but I do know this:

           As long as you have that exposed cable outside of the housing at both ends, it's not going to work.

           The ferrules on both ends have to be snug in their respective sockets. If they're not, you're just moving the cable back and forth.

            I don't think you have the little deeely-bob on the end of the cable inserted into its proper place inside the handle bar control.

[ace.cafe]

I can't remember what the housing looks like because I removed mine so long ago.

But, you can just take the cable off and use the decompressor in push-button manner to decompress, and the world will go on just fine without any more frustration.

[Adrian II]

... and there's one less lever on the handelbars for neatness freaks!

What is missing from the top of your throttle cable is one of these:



https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-ROYAL-ENFIELD-BULLET-ACCELERATOR-CUT-BUSH-NIPPLE-PAIR-MOTORCYCLE-PARTS/332101981131?hash=item4d52d213cb:g:P0oAAOSw44BYh3Aq

A.

[ddavidv]

I can't remember what the housing looks like because I removed mine so long ago.

But, you can just take the cable off and use the decompressor in push-button manner to decompress, and the world will go on just fine without any more frustration.

That's what I have been doing. And that is mostly okay but certainly not convenient. I'm the type of person who sees the decompressor lever and is just annoyed by it not working.
I know, your next response will be 'take the lever off'. 

[tooseevee]

That's what I have been doing. And that is mostly okay but certainly not convenient. I'm the type of person who sees the decompressor lever and is just annoyed by it not working.

       Here's one from India that appears to come with the cable hooked up to the decompressor unit. Maybe that (+ the missing split ferrule) would help you since you can't get the cable attached to the decompressor properly.

http://www.almosauto.in/royal-enfield-bullet-standard-decompressor-assembly-with-cable.html

        But, then again, it may not come that way. Who knows? And you already HAVE a brand new cable.

         Be thankful for ONE thing and that is that you do NOT have the horrible mashup that they came up with in 2008 for MY AVL. I finally removed The Whole Thing from the handlebar lever down including the lever.   

[Bilgemaster]

Just a quick poorly lit pic of my own 2005's decompressor lever's grubby underbelly to confirm that all you'll likely need to get yours working properly is one of those slotted ferrule doodads for the cable housing's end to ride in. Oddly enough I can find no mention of it whatsoever in the official Spare Parts Catalog, although there's also a matching one for the throttle cable.

If you slack off the adjuster all the way on the top of the decompressor assembly screwed into the head, you may get just enough play in the cable in its housing to finesse that slotted ferrule over the cable and into hole in the switchgear housing without disassembly of the whole shebang.

I imagine most semi-decent motorcycle shops could square you away with a suitable slotted ferrule for a couple-few bucks tops. In the meantime, have a good look around on the garage floor. It's the kind of thing that can easily fall off unnoticed and roll under that cobwebby pile of old steamship parts next to those stacks of 8-Tracks.

[tooseevee]

Oddly enough I can find no mention of it whatsoever in the official Spare Parts Catalog, although there's also a matching one for the throttle cable.

       The Parts Catalog has no coverage of the decompressor type that he has that's in the head. It only covers the type such that I had in my 2008 (Pg. 16) which runs a cable down to the tappet cover where it's attached to a through shaft with an attached cam that rotates and jams against the exhaust valve pushrod and holds it in the open position.

[Adrian II]

Sorry if I mis-identified the cable, though Bilgemeaster's photo shows that you are missing something similar.

The E/S switchgear here is a copy of what was fitted to Suzukis of the the period or slightly earlier, only what serves as the decomp lever on your Bullet would, I believe, have been for the carb enrichener/cold start device on the Suzuki.  This was an OK swap for the iron barrel Bullet with the old decompressor valve, but as tooseevee rightly points out, it was a terrible idea for the valve lifter on the AVL models.

A.

[tooseevee]

Sorry if I mis-identified the cable, though Bilgemeaster's photo shows that you are missing something similar.

The E/S switchgear here is a copy of what was fitted to Suzukis of the the period or slightly earlier, only what serves as the decomp lever on your Bullet would, I believe, have been for the carb enrichener/cold start device on the Suzuki.  This was an OK swap for the iron barrel Bullet with the old decompressor valve, but as tooseevee rightly points out, it was a terrible idea for the valve lifter on the AVL models.

A.

            P.S.: For those who may not know, I got tired of the whole thing and removed it all including the handlebar lever. Haven't missed it a bit. I loved it for shutting down the engine and avoiding kick-backs, but, and this is very weird and I can't explain it, as soon as I went to the Pertronix coil and a Champion plug (instead of the NGK) I have not had a single kick-back when shutting down with the key. It just silently stops rotating.

      I'm sure the plug is the reason, but I can't explain why.

[Bilgemaster]

       The Parts Catalog has no coverage of the decompressor type that he has that's in the head. It only covers the type such that I had in my 2008 (Pg. 16) which runs a cable down to the tappet cover where it's attached to a through shaft with an attached cam that rotates and jams against the exhaust valve pushrod and holds it in the open position.

Must be a later AVL Spare Parts Catalog you have. The Iron Barrel in-head decompressor assembly is shown in Group 02-50 'Cylinder Head' of my May 2003 one (Part 142145), pages 44 & 45 as items 22 through 31. The cable is shown elsewhere along with the others, but I see no sign of that cable end split ferrule doodad, nor the (identical?) one my '05 also has at the throttle.

[Adrian II]

OK, from the Indian domestic "Combined Spare Parts Catalog(ue) Retired Models", Dec. 2013 update.

Section 08-10 Handlebar and Controls

Item 13 in the parts drawing, part number 560116/A Ferrule (De compressor)

Shown as being used on both K/S and E/S models - good hunting.

A.

[tooseevee]

Must be a later AVL Spare Parts Catalog you have. The Iron Barrel in-head decompressor assembly is shown in Group 02-50 'Cylinder Head' of my May 2003 one (Part 142145), pages 44 & 45 as items 22 through 31. The cable is shown elsewhere along with the others, but I see no sign of that cable end split ferrule doodad, nor the (identical?) one my '05 also has at the throttle.

      Yes, we have different catalogs.

       As far as the ferrule goes, it's Item 10 Part #560116/a and it's on Page 76/77 of my catalog. As Adrian sez, the part is out there and it's the same, it's just different Item numbers and different pages.

        I've had a spare on the shelf for years now because in the early years of me raping the bike and making it mine, I lost it. So I ordered two. From Tim. He didn't charge me shipping 

          The ferrule for the throttle side is a different Part#. I don't know why. They must be different.

[Bilgemaster]

After another closer look at my Spares Catalog I now see in 07-10 'Handle Bar and Controls', pages 122 & 123, an item 15 styled as "Bush (Throttle Cable Stop)", Part  143314. Still no clear sign of one for the decompressor cable, but there is an item 22 in the listings styled simply as "Ferrule", Part 560116 that is shown nowhere in the diagram. It is indicated as being suitable for 500cc 5 Speeds with Electric Start.

On my bike, the two parts seem more or less identical, so maybe those part numbers will help our man find something more reasonably priced than the options shown here thus far ($28 shipping? Really?) that'll get him rolling again without scorched fingers.

Just a quick googling reveals that a "Ferrule throttle stop Minda control" Part 143314 can be had for the princely sum of exactly one pound from PricePart Motorcycles in England with 4.50 First Class shipping to the US of A. Still, that's better than $28. A bit more rummaging around "out there" might beat even that though.

[tooseevee]

After another closer look at my Spares Catalog I now see in 07-10 'Handle Bar and Controls', pages 122 & 123, an item 15 styled as "Bush (Throttle Cable Stop)", Part  143314. Still no clear sign of one for the decompressor cable, but there is an item 22 in the listings styled simply as "Ferrule", Part 560116 that is shown nowhere in the diagram. It is indicated as being suitable for 500cc 5 Speeds with Electric Start.

On my bike, the two parts seem more or less identical, so maybe those part numbers will help our man find something more reasonably priced than the options shown here thus far ($28 shipping? Really?) that'll get him rolling again without scorched fingers.

Just a quick googling reveals that a "Ferrule throttle stop Minda control" Part 143314 can be had for the princely sum of exactly one pound from PricePart Motorcycles in England with 4.50 First Class shipping to the US of A. Still, that's better than $28. A bit more rummaging around "out there" might beat even that though.

      I see both of those Part #s also in my catalog. 560116/a is called Ferrule (De Compressor). The "a" may be post '99 or some other date. Who knows? I think they're all the same.

      The part he needs is 560116/a. Fits the Minda Left Side Switchset.

       And to DDavidD: If you read this and want me to, I will send you the ferrule you need. Just give me an address.

[Arizoni]

I don't know about the part number systems used by Royal Enfield but at the jet engine company I worked for, the letter with the part number indicates the revision status of the drawing the part was made to.

Each drawing receives a change letter when any part of it is changed in any way so a drawing that has been changed 3 times would be up to change letter C.  A part made to that drawing would be marked something like 849330-C.

The revisions cannot change "form, fit or function" so, a "rev C" part will work just like a no change part or a "A" or "B" change part.

These drawing changes could revise the drawing notes or add additional views or do other things like that as long as the revised part was equal to or better than the previous part.

If the "form, fit or function" of the part was effected by the change, the part will be issued a totally new part number and the next higher assembly drawing parts list would be changed to require the new part.

[Bilgemaster]

Thanks for that explanation, Arizoni. The last of the "form, fit or function" criteria would explain why the seemingly identical ferrules used for the throttle and decompressor cables might have different part numbers entirely, and those letters tacked on had me kind of stumped when ordering my own cables.

In Amphicar parts designations one also often finds an "R" or "(R)" tacked on for "Replacement", meaning a substitution for an earlier original part that may no longer be available or for a similar but less costly one.

[ddavidv]

I would suspect that the letter at the end probably indicates a change in supplier of the part if it is not a total design change. Probably several 'cottage industry' suppliers in India that sold hardware to the RE factory for things they need not be bothered with making themselves.

tooseevee you've got mail!

I'm moving on from the decompressor issue to trying to fit my new muffler. It is a UK made shorty from Hitchcock's that comes with a very nice bracket...that doesn't work. Naturally. Bracket is too short and also fouls on the swing arm so I guess I'll need to make my own.

I also got new seals for the transmission/clutch/shifter so can take apart the primary AGAIN (3x I think now) and stop that annoying leak.

[tooseevee]

tooseevee you've got mail!

   Nope. It's 1:00PM and no mail yet.

[ddavidv]

You don't have a PM from me?

[tooseevee]

You don't have a PM from me?

       I am not notified of apersonal message waiting for me any more. I used to get an email when I had a PM waiting. No more.

       I only just two minutes ago learned from MattZ Forum Improvements that you have to look for a little envelope and click on it.

       So that's what I will do as soon as I get back from taking my dog out for her morning dump. I will find the little friggin' envelope and get your address

[tooseevee]

You don't have a PM from me?

       I've searched every message and have clicked on everything there is to click on and can find no personal message from you to me (or ANY PMs).

        Give it another try; we'll see.

         I'm not Notified any more (long time) of new posts on threads I'm following so maybe PM notification doesn't work any more. I sure as shit don't know. 

[tooseevee]

You don't have a PM from me?

     Well, I took a break and just came back (it's 10AM) and looked around again and wonder of wonders there it is at the TOP of the page NOT in the Message Section!

      SO. I now have your address and I'll get right on it.

[ddavidv]

I got the cable furrel or whatever it's called. Though it fits fine it isn't long enough to take up the slack. I'd need two of them. Local hardware store didn't have anything, suggested I try a bicycle shop. I'm giving up on using the cable for now; I'll just continue my pushing it manually with my fingers method.

Over the last couple evenings I took the primary apart again (I think this may be the 4th time) and pulled the inner cover off. Replaced the inner shifter shaft seal and also the seal behind the clutch. Somebody was definitely in this thing f*cking it all up because the clutch seal was put in backwards and the gasket was facing the clutch...sealing nothing. The level of ineptitude of whoever touched this thing before me was astronomical. Bear in mind that while I'm a pretty decent car mechanic I've never dove into a bike to the level of this one and have still managed to fix it correctly -- most of the time.

The upside of doing this job multiple times is I can zip through it pretty quickly. I've also mastered a few shortcuts, one of which is this clever tool (named for a faux company of a friend of mine who is always engineering stuff like this).


This is a chunk of one of the bottles of vinegar I used to try to clean the fuel tank out. No more fussing about with feeler gauges!

Buttoned back together I no longer have ANY Type F leaking from the primary case.  I also swear the thing runs better than before. I didn't detect any clutch slippage either.
I still have to attach my Hitchcock's muffler to replace the too-loud Emgo I'm currently using. The supplied bracket is too short. I picked up a length of similar steel at the hardware store yesterday and just have to bend it and drill a couple of holes.

[ddavidv]

Swapped out my Emgo muffler for a 'shorty' pea shooter type from Hitchcock's.
Where did all this power come from??
I can now use 5th gear on flat roads, not just down hills. Amazing! The back pressure difference must be remarkable. I'm curious to have a look at the plug and see what it's burning like. The Emgo was a bit sooty since I added the air filter.

[tooseevee]

I got the cable furrel or whatever it's called. Though it fits fine it isn't long enough to take up the slack. I'd need two of them. Local hardware store didn't have anything, suggested I try a bicycle shop. I'm giving up on using the cable for now; I'll just continue my pushing it manually with my fingers method.

       Sorry, but that ferrule is not too long or too short. It is the part that goes there and it's not supposed to correct the length of the cable or anything like that. And you're not supposed to use two to correct an incorrect cable length problem. It's just to make the transition from the cable housing to the hole in the switchgear housing.

         I think there is something very simple and very basic about your cable problem and you and none of us seem to be getting to it. But the problem is NOT the ferrule.

        Good luck.

[ddavidv]

I agree, it's not the ferrule being wrong (it's not; I can see it should be there). I was going to try adding one just to see if it would make the cable function. There is something still wrong but I am clueless as to what. I'm torn between my INTJ need to have things that should work working and not giving a flying fig, the latter which would make my life easier. 

[Bilgemaster]

Maybe you just got the wrong type cable on there? Something for another model or some previous owner's unsuccessful make-do attempt at a fix? I believe we've long since established that not everything done to this bike in the past has been "according to Hoyle".

[tooseevee]

Maybe you just got the wrong type cable on there? Something for another model or some previous owner's unsuccessful make-do attempt at a fix? I believe we've long since established that not everything done to this bike in the past has been "according to Hoyle".

        Those have been exactly my own thoughts for a long time now. It seems that something's just not right about that cable. It just Will Not work if the cable housing is not the correct length and that's what it seems like to me.

[Bilgemaster]

You could MAKE it work with one of those little screw-on type cable ends (a suitable set of which should be in everyone's tool pouch) by trimming the inner cable, but in view of the low cost of a proper new cable, why bother?

[ddavidv]

I have a proper new cable. It is identical to the allegedly improper cable currently on the bike.

[ace.cafe]

It is possible that the JRC carb might have a fit issue with that OEM cable which is for a Mikarb/Mikuni.

[tooseevee]

It is possible that the JRC carb might have a fit issue with that OEM cable which is for a Mikarb/Mikuni.

    Yes. Had to get a different cable to work on the TM32 on mine.

      But I'm totally confused now. Are we talking about his decompressor cable now or his throttle cable? 

 

[ace.cafe]

    Yes. Had to get a different cable to work on the TM32 on mine.

      But I'm totally confused now. Are we talking about his decompressor cable now or his throttle cable? 

 

Oh, sorry.
I got crossed up and commented on the wrong cable.

[ddavidv]

I used 'Emma' as a subject for a video so if you want to see more of her here is the link. https://youtu.be/Qs_pLiSTzoA

I stumbled about with the dates and a detail or two because I neglected to make notes but put a disclaimer in the description. Some of my comments are opinion, of course, so disagree as necessary. 

[ddavidv]

Reading another forum about a brand X bike I realized I may have a concern with the head stock bearings.

When on the center stand the front will flop over one way or the other with no resistance. I had tightened the central nut when I first got it because I detected play in the assembly. Had to crank on it pretty good. Seems it should be tighter than what I currently have it but am a bit loathe to put much more torque on it. Give it a twist with a long bar or do we think the brearings are spent?

[ace.cafe]

My practice has always been to just barely take out the play. Flopping to the side on centerstand is fine, as long as there is no play. These are ball bearings on races. Many other Brands of bikes may have rollers which feel different.

[Arizoni]

The torque method for the steering head bearings on the UCE after taking it apart and greasing the bearings without removing them is:
First torque the big nut to 18 to 20 NM (13-15 lb/ft).  Then back off nut and re-torque to 2 to 4 NM (1.4 - 2.9 lb/ft or 17 - 35 pound/inches).

I am pretty sure the torque and method for the Iron barrel is the same.

At these low torque figures I would expect the fork to flop back and forth easily when everything is done right.

[tooseevee]

The torque method for the steering head bearings on the UCE after taking it apart and greasing the bearings without removing them is:
First torque the big nut to 18 to 20 NM (13-15 lb/ft).  Then back off nut and re-torque to 2 to 4 NM (1.4 - 2.9 lb/ft or 17 - 35 pound/inches).

I am pretty sure the torque and method for the Iron barrel is the same.

At these low torque figures I would expect the fork to flop back and forth easily when everything is done right.

         Since ddavidd has an AVL not a UCE, I'll just add this comment:

          Somewhere way back in my ROM, it seems to me I recall long discussions about this sometime in the first years I had the '08 AVL and it seems to me I remember (paraphrased) "Loosen the pinch bolts. Tighten the big nut to 55 pounds. Back it off a bit. Retorque to 15 pounds. Tighten pinch bolts.

      There was also discussion about whether or not you had to loosen the large Allen bolt set screw under the handlebar bracket (hold down) before torqueing.

[heloego]

Service manual for my '06 ElectraX (paraphrased) in Section 3 Page 3-26 says to:
1. Loosen the headlamp casing allen screw,
2. Loosen crown plate (fork pinch) bolts,
3. Tighten the Stem Nut,
4. Check play,
5. Steering to be free without any play,
6. Tighten all screws in reverse order.
I noted my manual does not give a torque value for the Stem Nut.

Snidal's Bullet Service Manual says to get the bike on a center stand and with the rear weighted to get the front tire off the ground. Rotate the front left-to-right and tighten the Stem Nut until you feel some tension in the handle bar movement, then back it off until the tension is just gone. Then tighten the clamp(crown) bolts.

[tooseevee]

Service manual for my '06 ElectraX (paraphrased) in Section 3 Page 3-26 says to:
1. Loosen the fork pinch bolts,
2. Loosen the Set screw under the stem nut,
3. Tighten the Stem Nut,
4. Assembly the reverse of the same.
I noted my manual does not give a torque value for the Stem Nut.

     That's how I did mine a few years ago. I torqued to 55, backed off, retorqued to 15.

       Seems to be fine.

        If I ever do it again I'll have to get my 18" breaker bar back. I gave it to a friend. I did keep the socket however. I've given a lot of stuff away to friends so it doesn't get shit-canned when I die.

[ace.cafe]

It is important to not tighten the ball bearing too much or it will flatten the balls or the race. A tiny bit of play is better than cranked down too tight.