Unofficial Royal Enfield Community Forum
Royal Enfield Motorcycles => Bullet with the UCE engine => Topic started by: Royal.Oilfield on January 21, 2009, 11:14:39 am
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Just spotted the article about Cycle Worlds visit to India. From page 36 on you'll find six pages of a nice and positively written article about the new C5. Mr. Ravinchadran and Mr. Lal talk about the development of the new bike and its design features and about Royal Enfields future.
The author has a positive impression about the bikes capabilities and states the bike is worth the money.
From page 44 on you'll find two pages named "Package From India" a story about the "old" Bullet.
Johann
http://www.zinio.com/gncoffer?issn=0011-4286&of=ZH1&ns=usa
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thanks for that Johann - an interesting & positive article - the futures bright for RE by the sounds of it ;D
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Nothing screams classic bike like the sound of an electric starter. Leaving out the kick start is my only complaint though. I think it has it's place in the retro market.
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Johann, I thank you for sharing the link with the all of us! It was an informative article. We will get more detailed information about the performance of the C5, as it becomes available in the UK (and the rest of Europe)!
Keep the shiny side up!
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Great read on the C5...It just whets my appetite for one.
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Nothing screams classic bike like the sound of an electric starter. Leaving out the kick start is my only complaint though. I think it has it's place in the retro market.
I agree totally deejay, they said they had done research & found that no one used the kick when an electric was fitted – therefore they didn’t produce the C5 with a kick. They also go on further in the article to explain the lengths they went to in order to make the bike authentic - “ the stitching & leather on the saddle” etc.
If they had done decent any market research with UK, US & European importers & dealers they would certainly have been told that most potential customers would want the bike to be as ‘authentic’ & as retro looking as possible – the C5 (IMHO) should have been produced with a kick.
I’ve been waiting a long time for a RE & this bike really excites me – if the C5 had a kick I would have put an order for one already – but I’ll still check it out now when it gets to dealers (hopefully next month).
The good thing is that the RE brand will grow & improve with new & exiting future models – I’m sure they will consider re-introducing a kick a few years down the line.
Someone has just offered me a reasonably priced Triumph Bonnie – I’m rather tempted to go for that & delay my venture into the world of RE.
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Meh, up until the latest models, the new Bonnevilles have used a reportedly unreliable carb and have gotten downright embarrassing gas mileage for a modern bike. I've heard in the neighborhood of 25 mpg in the worst cases, and I've heard worse still about the bike's overall reliability and maintenance.
Unless your buddy's got the real article, an honest to God vintage Bonnie, I'd say don't bother.
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Someone has just offered me a reasonably priced Triumph Bonnie – I’m rather tempted to go for that & delay my venture into the world of RE.
I had a new Bonneville a few years back, I did not like it at all. Bad gas mileage as reported, HEAVY for it's size, slow, and it felt like a new japanese bike with no soul. Those are just my opinions though, a lot of people love them. My favorite "retro" bike would still have to be the Kawasaki W650 (has kickstart). I'll wait to see the new Enfields before I judge them any further. Everything else looks pretty good on them... time will tell.
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Thanks for the advice guys - It’s a 2001 790cc parallel twin, mpg is not too bad on these bikes, around 50 for steady riding along with more than twice the horse than a C5. Anyway - still really want a RE but probably wont lose too much on this if I sell it on again in 6 months or so!
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While it is true as reported that the new C-5 does not have a kickstarter, the new G-5 does. Just to be clear the G-5's should be available in March in limited numbers. The C-5's will not be available until late spring or very early summer.
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Thanks for the advice guys - It’s a 2001 790cc parallel twin, mpg is not too bad on these bikes, around 50 for steady riding along with more than twice the horse than a C5. Anyway - still really want a RE but probably wont lose too much on this if I sell it on again in 6 months or so!
I have a 2001 Bonnie - no problems, I get about 50 MPG. Good performance and handling (but not in the sport-bike sense). Easy to drive - low seat height and usable power. Planning on buying a new RE to "keep it company."
Enjoy your new bike!
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While it is true as reported that the new C-5 does not have a kickstarter, the new G-5 does. Just to be clear the G-5's should be available in March in limited numbers. The C-5's will not be available until late spring or very early summer.
Do you have an opinion as to the logic behind that decision?
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Guys, you should embrace the electric starter. It is the one thing that opened up the motorcycle market to the general populace, and it will bring Royal Enfield into the popular fold. With the increased sales it will garner to the brand there should be much money available for R&D for other projects.
You have no idea how many people are terrified of a kick starter. Every one has an Uncle Harold story: "My Uncle Harold busted his ankle when the kick starter flipped him over the bike."
I can hardly even sell a DIRT bike if it doesn't have an electric starter. People have walked out of my store because they saw a kick lever on a unit they were interested in. No matter that the the unit had an electric starter also. The mere presence of the kick lever was too intimidating.
Scary, sad, but true.
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Guys, you should embrace the electric starter. It is the one thing that opened up the motorcycle market to the general populace, and it will bring Royal Enfield into the popular fold. With the increased sales it will garner to the brand there should be much money available for R&D for other projects.
You have no idea how many people are terrified of a kick starter. Every one has an Uncle Harold story: "My Uncle Harold busted his ankle when the kick starter flipped him over the bike."
I can hardly even sell a DIRT bike if it doesn't have an electric starter. People have walked out of my store because they saw a kick lever on a unit they were interested in. No matter that the the unit had an electric starter also. The mere presence of the kick lever was too intimidating.
Scary, sad, but true.
I know it's not in the best interest of R.E., but I like the fact I'm not riding a "popular" motorcycle.
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Guys, you should embrace the electric starter. It is the one thing that opened up the motorcycle market to the general populace, and it will bring Royal Enfield into the popular fold.
I don't deny the electric start will make the bike more accessible to different types of owners which is good for business. I hope RE and RE USA are very successful in selling this bike, they deserve it and I may look into one for myself in the future. I just feel that the reasons given for leaving out the kickstart are odd and not consistent with what I've experienced among current Enfield owners. If they had said, "it costs too much" or "it would be too hard to fix a broken pawl with the new design", then I wouldn't have even brought it up.
The usual quote I get about my bike...
"hey that's a CLASSIC! Wow, it's even got a kickstart!"
The future quote of the C-5
"hey that looks like a CLASSIC! Wow, it's even got the old style stitching on the seat!"
;) :D ;)
My overall impression of the new bike is positive though. I hope you sell a lot of them Vince.
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deejay - You have hit the nail on the head & I agree totally with your comments ;D
I would be interested t know if WS had been consulted about the lack of c5 kicker or if all the decisions were made in India!.
I wish all the new models well & hope the dealers sell plenty (I think they will). ;D
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Thanks for the advice guys - It’s a 2001 790cc parallel twin, mpg is not too bad on these bikes, around 50 for steady riding along with more than twice the horse than a C5. Anyway - still really want a RE but probably wont lose too much on this if I sell it on again in 6 months or so!
I have a 2001 Bonnie - no problems, I get about 50 MPG. Good performance and handling (but not in the sport-bike sense). Easy to drive - low seat height and usable power. Planning on buying a new RE to "keep it company."
Enjoy your new bike!
Thanks WKinNJ, not after sports bike so sould be fine - it will be a stop gap before I get a RE ;)
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All of the importers were consulted about the design of both the E-5 and the C-5 over a period of three years. I am guessing that no motorcycle manufacturer has ever relied so heavily on importer input. They also spent quite a bit of time showing preliminary designs to dealers here and in Europe. (Under threat of death if they revealed anything, I think Vince was one of these).
We were all a bit surprised when they actually implemented most of the changes we requested. To be sure there is not universal agreement from importers, but when the final product was shown to us, the room went silent as we were all shocked at how well they had done.
Vince is right about the kick starter. When I first opened CMW we only had Kick Start bikes. Sales resistance was very high. I could teach a 90 lb woman to kick start one in 2 minutes (and often did), but it was a huge problem. When we finally talked them into an ES I was nervous because many Old school guys predicted our demise. As you know sales went way up and even the Old School guys bought. Vince is also right that very few people (including dealers) have any idea of how to kickstart a big single and it appears very intimidating.
When they built the UCE the original engine is the one you will see in the G-5. It has a KS. When the design of the C-5 came out, while it is the same engine the cases etc are quite different and much more stylized. The design team decided that the KS detracted from the look and the mechanical guys wanted it gone to show how much confidence they had in the new ES system. Right wrong or indifferent this is the unvarnished history of how we got here. We understand that some of you are hung up on the KS and understand why so I guess time will tell.
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One serious omission about this whole thing is that our own Vince set up the bike that Peter Egan wrote about in his story about the Military bike. We picked Vince to do this even though he was 2,000 miles away for a reason and our confidence was rewarded.
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Well, as king of the Luddites, I also would have preferred a kicker on the C5.
I like the old-time styling of the C5, and I like how they styled the side cover smoother and rounder on the C5, than they did on the G5 with the kicker.
I like it in many ways, but still wish it had that nice smooth round engine cover along with the kicker.
I also hope they sell well, and that RE and CMW are successful with it. And I do hope that it spawns more products for us, for both the older bikes and the newer ones.
Maybe someday there'll even be a resurrected "retro Interceptor 750 twin"(Gasp!)
I've been noticing lately how much my ways of thinking are askew of alot of current thought patterns in the world today, in many areas.
Perhaps I'm just getting old.
But, ya know what?
I like the old things, for what they are/were. They just have a certain "something"..
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One serious omission about this whole thing is that our own Vince set up the bike that Peter Egan wrote about in his story about the Military bike. We picked Vince to do this even though he was 2,000 miles away for a reason and our confidence was rewarded.
Of course VInce did it, he's the (RE) MAN!
Speaking of kick/electric starters, when I demo'd the Electra last summer I couldn't get it started via kick but did get a sore right leg. I used to own an SR500, kickstart only, but the RE was a different (and tighter as new) beast.
When I was done (and sadly declined to purchase), Vince turned the ignition key and used the ... ... ... electric start.
Ace, I hear you on getting older and wanting the old ways to be available. But I'm getting older too and agree with RE that electric start will open up the market for them.
Besides, the G5 looks great (I prefer it to the C5, at least on computer screen viewing) and has kickstart.
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Kevin - I appreciate your reply & it's great to hear how much you guys contributed during the design process - the C5 is without doubt a beautiful looking bike & I'm sure with all the development work that's gone into it, it will have increased reliability & bring a new breed of people over to RE.
I too am a bit of a 'luddite' when it comes to things like this. I'll await the release of C5 in UK (hopefully next month ;D) - I can then judge the C5 alongside the G5 & hopefully take a test ride - I think to take a test ride of the two bikes (certainly over in UK) I'd have to take a visit to WS - don't expect the local dealer will have both bikes as demos.
I think within the Uk the C5 is approx 20% more than the G5 - I like the look of both but the C5 just does it for me ;)
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All of the importers were consulted about the design of both the E-5 and the C-5 over a period of three years. I am guessing that no motorcycle manufacturer has ever relied so heavily on importer input. They also spent quite a bit of time showing preliminary designs to dealers here and in Europe. (Under threat of death if they revealed anything, I think Vince was one of these).
We were all a bit surprised when they actually implemented most of the changes we requested. To be sure there is not universal agreement from importers, but when the final product was shown to us, the room went silent as we were all shocked at how well they had done.
Vince is right about the kick starter. When I first opened CMW we only had Kick Start bikes. Sales resistance was very high. I could teach a 90 lb woman to kick start one in 2 minutes (and often did), but it was a huge problem. When we finally talked them into an ES I was nervous because many Old school guys predicted our demise. As you know sales went way up and even the Old School guys bought. Vince is also right that very few people (including dealers) have any idea of how to kickstart a big single and it appears very intimidating.
When they built the UCE the original engine is the one you will see in the G-5. It has a KS. When the design of the C-5 came out, while it is the same engine the cases etc are quite different and much more stylized. The design team decided that the KS detracted from the look and the mechanical guys wanted it gone to show how much confidence they had in the new ES system. Right wrong or indifferent this is the unvarnished history of how we got here. We understand that some of you are hung up on the KS and understand why so I guess time will tell.
Thanks for the explanation.
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I'm glad that I got my old Bullet, and a bunch of spare parts.
Maybe they should give a free coupon for Starbuck's Latte along with purchase of the new bike.
And a cup holder.
Maybe a small vanity mirror for applying lipstick. :D
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Maybe they should give a free coupon for Starbuck's Latte along with purchase of the new bike.
And a cup holder.
Maybe a small vanity mirror for applying lipstick. :D
Ace, you're mean. ;)
Give 'em a chance.
Regards, Johann
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I have to admit we have looked at putting cup holders in our catalog over the last couple of years, but haven't had the nerve.
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Maybe they should give a free coupon for Starbuck's Latte along with purchase of the new bike.
And a cup holder.
Maybe a small vanity mirror for applying lipstick. :D
Ace, you're mean. ;)
Give 'em a chance.
Regards, Johann
I know.
I'm a meanie!
Just keepin' it real!
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I have sold more than a few cup holders over the years. One guy even complained that his latte cooled off too fast. I didn't know how to address his problem so he had his buddy wire in some kind of heating element. I got to re-wire the circuit through a fused circuit that turned off with the key so it wouldn't run down his battery when he stopped.
Every so often i still bang my head against the wall over it.
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I'm glad that I got my old Bullet, and a bunch of spare parts.
Maybe they should give a free coupon for Starbuck's Latte along with purchase of the new bike.
And a cup holder.
Maybe a small vanity mirror for applying lipstick. :D
ahahaha
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::) ::)
ace.cafe (a.k.a. Kick Start and Kid Start)
::) ::)
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I too am nostalgic enough to like the idea of a kick start, but my somewhat arthritic knee and ankle could do without.
So I'll defer to my joints.... ;D
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About the new Bonneville...I had an '02 one and got 50mpg all the time. I no longer own it as I did not like the hard shifting,unimpressive braking,very hard seat, just average suspension and it was too heavy for a 800 twin. Did like the engine though but the bike as a whole just didn't cut it for me. LouA.
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Cool beans.
I like the idea of a KS as backup in case the battery goes toes up, but otherwise it's not a deal breaker for me. I kick start my Ural about 96% of the time. Appreciate all the background about how the C5/G5 came to be developed.
But otherwise, can't wait to see one of these new RE's in the States. I'm a sucker for that old school look with new bike relability. I plan to have an RE in the garage sooner rather than later. 8)
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While it is true as reported that the new C-5 does not have a kickstarter, the new G-5 does. Just to be clear the G-5's should be available in March in limited numbers. The C-5's will not be available until late spring or very early summer.
Kev, what's the difference between the G-5 with the kickstarter, and the C-5 without one? I love the kickstarter and only use the ES if needed (almost never) in traffic. I also love what the reports say about this bike, but if buying one, I'd add it to my '08 classic, rather than replace the iron barreled classic... it's nice having a delightful-to-ride piece of history in the garage, but it would be nice to be able to run at 70mph with my big dog BMW buddies.
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I have to admit we have looked at putting cup holders in our catalog over the last couple of years, but haven't had the nerve.
Awww, go ahead and put one in. I'd buy one for use on a long hot ride... and I can even get the straw into my mouth when wearing my 'period' Cromwell helmet! ;)
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But otherwise, can't wait to see one of these new RE's in the States. I'm a sucker for that old school look with new bike relability. I plan to have an RE in the garage sooner rather than later. 8)
+1 ;D
Hate to not be all authentic "old school" and stuff, but a bike as good looking as the C5 with modern components, really works for me!