Author Topic: Bullet 500 restoration part 2  (Read 878 times)

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MadRat

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on: March 18, 2023, 04:33:17 am
Check out part 2 where I remove the top end and discover just how bad the crankshaft was. It’s for the best, though, as putting a new top end on and old Indian crankshaft would’ve been foolish. New European crankshaft on the way 😁 - https://youtu.be/94MvODeZzS8


AzCal Retred

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Reply #1 on: March 18, 2023, 05:51:48 am
The oil system needs checking. The pump discs can be replaced with high volume units and lapped back in. You probably got the rolling element big end crank from Hitchcock's or the reworked unit from Price Parts? The scavenge pump will benefit from the pressure relief valve kit. The main oil pump won't need it as the roller crank doesn't offer flow resistance. More oil flow is a good thing.

What's the plan for the top end? The Hitchcock's forged pistons run steel rings. A tougher piston is better than stock, the OEM ones can stick, drop a skirt or shed the crown. My 6.5:1 forged units rings actually sealed, eliminating crankcase foam issues. Higher compression pistons are useful if you are looking for a bit more puff. The alloy barrel is a nice piece too. It is definitely noisier than the iron barrel, but on a hot SoCal day it'll ease your mind a bit.
A trifecta of Pre-Unit Bullets: a Red Deluxe 500, a Green Standard 500, and a Black ES 350.


Raymond

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Reply #2 on: March 18, 2023, 10:22:51 am
Another enjoyable and informative video. I fully expect to go in there at some point in the future and it's very useful to see what you encounter before that so once again thank you!

I was surprised at your disdain for the decompressor valve. I use the decomp every time I start the bike - gently move the kick lever till it stops, pull the decomp, ease the engine just a little way, smile as I hear that drainpipe suction noise, then give a full-length kick to hopefully start 'er up. I haven't tried just kicking through compression but have assumed that I wouldn't be able to as it feels pretty solid up against compression? No plans to remove the decompressor valve on mine.

However, one area where I am ahead of you is removing the starter. I went full in and bought the non-ES inner chain-case. Swapping the inner case involves tapping the l/h engine case because the mounting bolts are in different places.

If interested, take a look in my intro thread:  https://forum.classicmotorworks.com/index.php?topic=32150.msg390842#msg390842

The relevant part is on page 19 of that rather long thread
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AzCal Retred

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Reply #3 on: March 18, 2023, 10:49:33 pm
Raymond @#2: " I use the decomp every time I start the bike " Until I fitted the new H's forged piston and steel rings the decomp wasn't as necessary, you could "bleed it over" pushing slowly. After the new bits were bedded in and sealing, it became necessary. Same CR as before, 6.5/1, but the OEM Velveeta soft piston & cast iron rings don't compare to the newfangled bits.  ;D
A trifecta of Pre-Unit Bullets: a Red Deluxe 500, a Green Standard 500, and a Black ES 350.


Mr_84

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Reply #4 on: March 19, 2023, 07:00:46 am
Yep I was surprised by the quick elimination of the de comp , mine is like a lead brick to get past TDC without it , but this can easy be refitted after the build and the broken ankle heals   ;)


Pasquinator

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Reply #5 on: March 19, 2023, 07:49:15 am
Great vids so far, I'm also knee deep into a restoration and I'm happy to see we all tend to share some common issues with these bikes.

I, like some of the others here, am also in favor of keeping the decompression valve. I find it's an integral part of the bike and quite useful for:

1. Circulating oil through the system prior to kickstarting; aka "priming" the bike
2. Turning the bike off with the decomp lever rather than the key, which I'm told is the healthy way to shut these things off
3. Finding TDC quickly when adjusting rockers, etc.
4  A vintage feel. That little "gun trigger" has a charm on it's own and its very in line with the whole "built like a gun" thing...
« Last Edit: March 19, 2023, 08:14:45 am by Pasquinator »
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Raymond

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Reply #6 on: March 19, 2023, 09:29:55 am
The other thing I noticed with Mad Rat's decomp is the possibly awkward lever position above the bar, which must mean moving your hand to reach it. On mine, when I replaced the plastic switchgear, bought a little chromed lever and fitted it under the bar, so convenient for a finger it's become second nature.

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1978 Yamaha XS650 Miss November
2003 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Deluxe


ddavidv

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Reply #7 on: March 19, 2023, 01:01:06 pm
Since replacing the piston in mine with a Hitchcocks there is no way I could kick mine past TDC without the decompressor. OP is cutting his cable and tossing parts on the ground and I'm just shaking my head muttering, "You'll be sorrrrry."
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AzCal Retred

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Reply #8 on: March 19, 2023, 04:33:28 pm
...but the all-new parts will work so smoothly!   ;D

"There's ALWAYS time to do it twice..." old work slogan
A trifecta of Pre-Unit Bullets: a Red Deluxe 500, a Green Standard 500, and a Black ES 350.


MadRat

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Reply #9 on: March 19, 2023, 06:22:05 pm
Thanks for all the comments guys. I’ll try to answer everything in this one reply. I’ve never had to use the decompression valve on the bike (and other bullets I’ve ridden) and can circulate oil by initially kicking it with the key off. If I regret it, it’s very easy to fit a new one.

I have new steel oil pumps that I’ll lap in and a new spindle & worm gear. I chose not to go with the higher flow pumps as I’m sticking with a standard/stock setup. I’ve heard the high flow pumps can actually cause issues.

The new barrel is iron with upgraded piston/rings. I was about to go with alloy, but want to maintain the vintage “two tone” look and feel.


AzCal Retred

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Reply #10 on: March 19, 2023, 07:05:12 pm
Hi-flo issues seem to be related to straight weight oils and cold weather. 10W40, 15W50 or Castrol 5W50 obviate it. Accelerated wear of the spindle is usually the symptom. The Hitchcock's hardened spindle is the real fix.

The iron barrel will be quieter. Some black spray paint on the alloy barrel would get you back to vintage and would maintain the better heat transfer rate. At 22ish HP it likely doesn't matter too much. Happy wrenching!
A trifecta of Pre-Unit Bullets: a Red Deluxe 500, a Green Standard 500, and a Black ES 350.


stinkwheel

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Reply #11 on: March 19, 2023, 09:23:20 pm
I think you're fitting a roller bearing big end crank? They put way less load on the pumps anyway. It takes a surprising amount of pressure to force oil through a floating bush big end as you'd find if you try to prime one with an oilcan inserted in the worm drive oil seal. In comparison, the roller bearing crank offers almost no resistance.

Heat dissipation isn't a huge issue on bullets in standard trim. if anything, they run too cold.


MadRat

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Reply #12 on: March 20, 2023, 12:59:36 am
@Raymond Excellent thread!


MadRat

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Reply #13 on: March 20, 2023, 01:00:53 am
@stinkwheel Yes, roller bearing big end crank


MadRat

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Reply #14 on: March 20, 2023, 01:02:40 am
Thanks @AzCal Retred and with this type of bike, the standard iron barrel will be fine. I’m trying to maintain some bit of originality to it as well