[Mort]

https://www.visordown.com/news/new-bikes/bsa-motorcycles-reveals-new-gold-star-650-2022-preview-event

A 650cc retro-modern Brit influenced, Indian made twin.

Now where have I heard that before? 🤣🤣🤣

[NJ Mike]

Single cylinder, liquid cooled, low revving, 45 hp, according to the vidiot. How long before BSA goes under, again?

Whatever.

[Mort]

Single cylinder, liquid cooled, low revving, 45 hp, according to the vidiot. How long before BSA goes under, again?

Whatever.

Apparently I need coffee before posting. Completely missed that it was a thumper.

Huh. That seems... foolish.

[supercub]

It looks neat, I like the pipe. I wouldn't toss my GT for it though. I didnt know BSA was back in the game. I would prefer a RE Classic 500 if they ever come about.

[JessHerbst]

It looks neat, I like the pipe. I wouldn't toss my GT for it though. I didnt know BSA was back in the game. I would prefer a RE Classic 500 if they ever come about.

Mahindra resurrected them. I own a Mahindra tractor and its been good. Not great but certainly gets the job done and is reliable.

[Jack Straw]

IF a big single is well counter balanced they're fun to ride but it seems a tall order to expect sales to more than a few harmless eccentrics.   In a way it reminds me of the Honda GB 500 in that it's a fun exercise in updated nostalgia that only lasted a year or two.

[Breezin]

I like it. Hard to beat the feel of a big ol' thumper.

As one passerby enthusiastically put it on seeing my old 500, 'One stroke per lamp post!'

[Bilgemaster]

Not the worst looking bike I've ever seen, but on the other hand that Visordown website is a real trial on a small device. Sweet Baby Jeebus! Could they possibly cram any more ads, snoodlets and other annoyances onto a webpage? I feel like I need a shower now.

Also odd is that the webpage offers no shots whatsoever of the lefthand side of the bike, though I did find one elsewhere: https://www.motorcyclenews.com/amp/news/new-bikes/2022-bsa-gold-star/. Having seen that, I suppose not really showcasing that side of the bike was understandable, since it is fairly Plain Jane.

Interesting that they're going with a 650 single á la Suzuki Savage, but water-cooled. I'm sort of curious to see if those first rider reviews don't include riders spitting out any fillings that may have been vibed out. There'll be no 240⁰ amelioration with that hefty single configuration. Maybe they came up with something else to subdue the beast?

[iblastoff]

Not the worst looking bike I've ever seen, but on the other hand that Visordown website is a real trial on a small device. Sweet Baby Jeebus! Could they possibly cram any more ads, snoodlets and other annoyances onto a webpage? I feel like I need a shower now.

Also odd is that the webpage offers no shots whatsoever of the lefthand side of the bike, though I did find one elsewhere: https://www.motorcyclenews.com/amp/news/new-bikes/2022-bsa-gold-star/. Having seen that, I suppose not really showcasing that side of the bike was understandable, since it is fairly Plain Jane.

Interesting that they're going with a 650 single á la Suzuki Savage, but water-cooled. I'm sort of curious to see if those first rider reviews don't include riders spitting out any fillings that may have been vibed out. There'll be no 240⁰ amelioration with that hefty single configuration. Maybe they came up with something else to subdue the beast?

just install adblock on whatever browser you're using. i havent seen ads in years, outside of random ones that get past the filter. i also have a youtube blocker that blocks stus videos from ever showing up in search results when i look for RE650 related videos haha.

as for this bike, i dont mind a single at all. its only 45hp. who cares. i'm guessing it'll weight closer to the 400lb range, which is really where the RE650 should be.

[Bilgemaster]

More on the new BSA here: https://youtu.be/dDFZAp4bR_4

[whippers]

IF a big single is well counter balanced they're fun to ride but it seems a tall order to expect sales to more than a few harmless eccentrics.   In a way it reminds me of the Honda GB 500 in that it's a fun exercise in updated nostalgia that only lasted a year or two.

People ask quite big money for them over here these days

[JessHerbst]

just install adblock on whatever browser you're using. i havent seen ads in years, outside of random ones that get past the filter. i also have a youtube blocker that blocks stus videos from ever showing up in search results when i look for RE650 related videos haha.

Buy a $30 Raspberry Pi, install free open source ‘PiHole’ software, put it on your home network and no more ads on any device in your home. Nothing to install on devices.

[Mort]

Buy a $30 Raspberry Pi, install free open source ‘PiHole’ software, put it on your home network and no more ads on any device in your home. Nothing to install on devices.

I've been meaning to do this for years. I've got three sitting in a drawer unused.

[YellowDuck]

Not the worst looking bike I've ever seen, but on the other hand that Visordown website is a real trial on a small device. Sweet Baby Jeebus! Could they possibly cram any more ads, snoodlets and other annoyances onto a webpage?

Could you please provide a definition of "snoodlet"?  I like this word...

[Voun]

Completely missed that it was a thumper.

Huh. That seems... foolish.

Hum, not sure. If the weight is contained and if they could hide that awful engine cooler  ...
I love big thumpers and I'm sure I'm not the only one ... Maybe because I owned a 500 XT ?

[Warwick]

its a thumper!  I love it!

[gizzo]

IF a big single is well counter balanced they're fun to ride but it seems a tall order to expect sales to more than a few harmless eccentrics.   In a way it reminds me of the Honda GB 500 in that it's a fun exercise in updated nostalgia that only lasted a year or two.

They're nostalgic for sure but also a blast to ride. I'd have one. I think they were pretty expensive when they were new and too many people bought into the "singles can't go on the freeway" thing. There's a few over here. Like whippers said, they're not giving them away, either.

I used to own a Suzuki Savage 650 single. It had a balance shaft and wasn't too bad for vibes. Smoother than my 535 Enfield for sure. I love bikes with the correct number of cylinders.

That "BSA" looks like a Yamaha SR500 (OK, or a Matchless G80). I'd rather have one of those. It has a history and wears it's own identity on the tank. Remember when Mahindra ran in Moto3? They weren't ashamed to put their own name on the tank when they were winning races....

[whippers]

 No interest here. A big thumper not nearly as nice to ride as a twin.  I guess it is designed to appeal more to the classic 500 brigade than those who buy the 650 twins

[Mort]

I'm just really confused about what Mahindra/BSA is trying to accomplish here. The article says they want to position it as a 'Premium' bike, though that could mean Indian-market 'Premium', which is where the RE Twins are.

At $5k with a decent dealer network they'd have something. At $6k they're going to struggle to take market share from RE with a brand that's not as well known (debatable, I know, but I'd argue that RE's constant production has kept their profile higher than BSA's defunct status.). Above that and it's DOA, especially since we're going to see similar bikes badged as Triumph but made in India this year.

[justonemore]

Love the look of it ... well until I saw the red one with the hideous white stripe on the tank top.

[dickim]

Fair Points Mort- personally I think for the retro age group the BSA name is more likely remembered whilst agreeing that R.E have the higher current profile.....
I could see myself with one alongside the Cont as I love, and even prefer the THUMPER FEEL of my C5 which is only  in storage due to MY (please no comments as its my call) feeling vulnerable on the quicker roads I NEED to use, now if the BSA had ability to cruise at 110kmh and a but left over I may just be tempted to extend the garage....

[Mort]

Fair Points Mort- personally I think for the retro age group the BSA name is more likely remembered whilst agreeing that R.E have the higher current profile.....
I could see myself with one alongside the Cont as I love, and even prefer the THUMPER FEEL of my C5 which is only  in storage due to MY (please no comments as its my call) feeling vulnerable on the quicker roads I NEED to use, now if the BSA had ability to cruise at 110kmh and a but left over I may just be tempted to extend the garage....

I was going to try to put this lightly, but realized there's no way: The people that remember BSA as an actual active brand are almost all dead. While Royal Enfield is a new name to the Western market (I know the Bullet's been available here for a while, but in such small numbers as to be a unicorn.) it's already gotten a bit of recognition. I don't think either brand has a particularly huge edge over the other, but when you throw in dealer networks and the realization that there's no direct line to the OG BSA as there is with RE then Mahindra's operating at a massive disadvantage.

But, as I pointed out, both should probably be holding their breath because when Triumph launches their lower displacement Indian manufactured bikes both RE and BSA/Mahindra are going to take a massive hit.

[biscot]

The people that remember BSA as an actual active brand are almost all dead.

Not yet. 

[dickim]

Just checked my pulse- All Good at 61 and whose 1st bike was a BSA Bantam passed down from my brother (1st car a mini) Called my 63yr old brother last night, all good and his 1st 2nd & 4th bikes were BSA's..... (he's now a H.D rider) in fact it was the late 70's / early 80's before we started buying Japanese,  and ALL the Guy's I rode with as a teenager are all still "with us" so will disagree were MOSTLY DEAD 🤣 but maybe our joints are!

Interestingly that the classic car clubs I'm involved in: Healey, MG,  and Chrome Bumpers, those who have bikes a few have Enfield's, and the common thread from other members is usually comparing to Norton's! am assuming the Cafe' Racer memories.....

Agree a lot will be down to dealers and networks U.S market a good example?? Here in Perth the opening of a 2nd dealer made a load of difference 😊

[justonemore]

The people that remember BSA as an actual active brand are almost all dead.

Not yet. 

The rumours of my death are greatly exaggerated.

[dickim]

The rumours of my death are greatly exaggerated.

🤣🤣🤣

[Mort]

When was the last BSA produced?

[dickim]

When was the last BSA produced?

Not Sure as we could only afford used & old, but absorbed into Norton- Villiers- Triumph in 72, a bit like BMC, MG, etc....became British Leyland and we know how well that went as well - Lets nationalise loss making companies into one....LOSS MAKING COMPANY😣

[dickim]

When was the last BSA produced?

Wiki says 73 was the last time badged  as BSA, 

[GSS]

Nice looking bike…..a nacelle and dual seat away from being a new Bullet 650 

[Bilgemaster]

Could you please provide a definition of "snoodlet"?  I like this word...

It's a smallish snood, once stuffed and made into decorative oil lamps similar to the henway of the outer isles of Nova Scotia or Newfoundland.

[supercub]

Im not sure who the sales target is that they are aiming for, or if they are just jumping into an existing market to try to make a win. The people that have nostalgia for BSA aren't the 20's and 30's crowd that were the market share of sales back in the day. Those people are now over the hooligan stage of their life and probably aren't looking to relive those days, taking a leap 40 years back in time. Enfield, however, as mentioned, has been active for years and has a following or reputation, good or bad to everyone, but those people view our twins as a step up and were willing to buy.
I havent seen the Honda 350 single here yet. Perhaps it is gaining popularity and they are trying to hedge in.
I would be interested to see what these Indian  Triumps are like.

[dickim]

It's a smallish snood, once stuffed and made into decorative oil lamps similar to the henway of the outer isles of Nova Scotia or Newfoundland.

O.k Bilge- what the Hell is a snood?

[JessHerbst]

…While Royal Enfield is a new name to the Western market (I know the Bullet's been available here for a while, but in such small numbers as to be a unicorn.) it's already gotten a bit of recognition. …

I’m 63 and have been riding things with two wheels and a motor since the late 1960s. (Can’t bring myself to classify my first mini bike with the Briggs & Stratton as a motorcycle).
 Until a few years ago I had never heard of Royal Enfield.
 When I’m out on my GT I frequently hear ‘Who Makes that?’, when I say ‘Royal Enfield’ the response is inevitably ‘Never heard of ‘em’.
 

[zimmemr]

I’m 63 and have been riding things with two wheels and a motor since the late 1960s. (Can’t bring myself to classify my first mini bike with the Briggs & Stratton as a motorcycle).
 Until a few years ago I had never heard of Royal Enfield.
 When I’m out on my GT I frequently hear ‘Who Makes that?’, when I say ‘Royal Enfield’ the response is inevitably ‘Never heard of ‘em’.

I'm a few years older and have been riding since 1966. I've always been a fan of RE, in fact an Interceptor was the first big street bike I wanted, in part due to an ad that ran in CYCLE magazine back in the day. I also worked in a shop that sold them, so I got to ride a few new late 60's Interceptors before they folded thier tent. I owned an elderly but very nice Constallation when my wife and first started dating 47 years ago and in fact bought my Interceptor, (partially financed by selling a 1966 BSA Lightening) because she noticed a photo of one and recalled how much she enjoyed riding on pillion on the "Connie." 

FWIW During the 60's Royal Enfields were distributed on the East Coast by Gene Shillingford & son in Philly PA, and Sam Avilleno in Boston Mass, so they may have been more popular here than out west. In Califorina they were sold by Shell Thuett, who built some seriously fast Bullet based dirt trackers in the late 50's and early 60's, and later went on to run Yamaha's dirt track team and tune for Kenny Roberts.

[Yinzer]

The bike doesn't look bad but I'd rather have an old bullet.

Every winter I have to run around with a hydrometer, do a load test & slog out the grippy tires.

I looked over at my RE and thought about how nice it was that it was air cooled.
No slipping on poison fluid & mopping it up before the dog licks it. No looking for little bubbles or zapping all over the engine with a IR gun.
I had 2 rear engine cars that were impossible to bleed air from unless you jacked the ass end over a foot off the ground.
At this point I really like simple.
I associate thumpers with simple.

[AzCal Retred]

The existing popular big 650cc single, the KLR650, has held up rather well over time. Maybe there's also hope for a "prettier" version from BSA.
Also, it's telling that this topic almost instantly ran 3 pages, possibly BSA has a winner?

[NVDucati]

Im not sure who the sales target is that they are aiming for, or if they are just jumping into an existing market to try to make a win. The people that have nostalgia for BSA aren't the 20's and 30's crowd that were the market share of sales back in the day. Those people are now over the hooligan stage of their life and probably aren't looking to relive those days, taking a leap 40 years back in time. Enfield, however, as mentioned, has been active for years and has a following or reputation, good or bad to everyone, but those people view our twins as a step up and were willing to buy.
I havent seen the Honda 350 single here yet. Perhaps it is gaining popularity and they are trying to hedge in.
I would be interested to see what these Indian  Triumps are like.

It isn't impossible that some of, or one of, upper management might just be motorcycle fan, with a BSA fetish.

[supercub]

The Honda 350 is coming to the US for 2022. Cant wait to see one in the flesh.

[Voun]

The Honda 350 is coming to the US for 2022. Cant wait to see one in the flesh.

How many HP ? 21 ! Sorry but not for me althougt the bike is really pretty, but as a young man of 62 I will wait a few years to downsize 

[Voun]

Even if 47 HP ...   

[Mort]

How many HP ? 21 ! Sorry but not for me althougt the bike is really pretty, but as a young man of 62 I will wait a few years to downsize 

Even if 47 HP ...   

I dunno if it could be considered 'Downsizing' since it's almost the exact same specs as the Interceptor, sans a cylinder. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

And we might be waiting a while. The info I've seen says that it's destined for the Brit market first, then India. I don't know if we're high on the export list.

[Voun]

I was talking about the 350 Honda and its 21 hp ... I'm really enthousiastic about the Gold Star on the contrary

[bluebus]

i think they look nice but that cooler looks nasty.

[supercub]

It is pretty body looking.

[whippers]

I was talking about the 350 Honda and its 21 hp ... I'm really enthousiastic about the Gold Star on the contrary

I don’t understand why they are so gutless.  I bought a Honda CB250RS new in 1985 and it had 26hp back then

[20MarkIII]

Seeing a few more YT vids from the show and Andy, TMF has a good one. Walk around views and shows the various color schemes of the new Gold Star. In the comments he states that after speaking with the BSA reps price should be in the 5000-7000 range. I'm presuming that's British Pounds. I think it's a nice looking bike.
With Norton going into production that brings back the British Big 4 if in name only. May very well go on sale first in the UK even before India.

[gizzo]

With Norton going into production that brings back the British Big 4 if in name only. May very well go on sale first in the UK even before India.

Bringing back the Norton Big 4, for sure!!

[Bilgemaster]

O.k Bilge- what the Hell is a snood?

Well, the je ne sais quack  of the "snood", being neither duck nor drake, can be challenging to define, but according to research done by University of Mississippi's Dr. Richard Buchholz [Transcription Source: Google, edited for length], "In addition to uncovering a non-sexual function for the brightly colored, bare head of the male (which is crucial for maintaining sub-lethal body temperatures under warm ambient conditions and during physical exertion), my work also demonstrated that one aspect of male head ornamentation, the frontal process, or snood, is subject to both inter-sexual and intrasexual selection. Captives prefer to mate with long snooded males, and during dyadic interactions, males deferred to males with relatively longer snoods. These results were demonstrated using both live males and controlled artificial models of males."

Hence, according to Dr. Buchholz' research, the females prefer a long snood for their gobbler. But what is the genetic advantage of a long snood?

Dr. Buchholz continues:

"In the wild the long snooded males preferred by females and avoided by males seemed to be resistant to coccidia infection."

And isn't THAT a relief for those blessed with truly ponderous prodigious snood!

I trust that clears this up.

Figure 1: Exobiologic Snood it is. Want one you do.

[gizzo]

Well, the je ne sais quo  of the "snood" can be difficult to define, but according to research done by University of Mississippi's Dr. Richard Buchholz [Source: Google], "In addition to uncovering a non-sexual function for the brightly colored, bare head of the male (which is crucial for maintaining sub-lethal body temperatures under warm ambient conditions and during physical exertion), my work also demonstrated that one aspect of male head ornamentation, the frontal process, or snood, is subject to both inter-sexual and intrasexual selection. Captives prefer to mate with long snooded males, and during dyadic interactions, males deferred to males with relatively longer snoods. These results were demonstrated using both live males and controlled artificial models of males."

Hence, according to Dr. Buchholz' research, the females prefer a long snood for their gobbler. But what is the genetic advantage of a long snood?

Dr. Buchholz continues:

"In the wild the long snooded males preferred by females and avoided by males seemed to be resistant to coccidia infection."

And isn't THAT a relief for those blessed with truly ponderous prodigious snood!

I trust that clears this up.

Nar, it's just a knot you use to tie a fish hook to a line.

you're welcome.

[dickim]

Thx Bilge- now " My Brain Hurts" 🤣👍

[iblastoff]

I’m 63 and have been riding things with two wheels and a motor since the late 1960s. (Can’t bring myself to classify my first mini bike with the Briggs & Stratton as a motorcycle).
 Until a few years ago I had never heard of Royal Enfield.
 When I’m out on my GT I frequently hear ‘Who Makes that?’, when I say ‘Royal Enfield’ the response is inevitably ‘Never heard of ‘em’.

royal enfield just isnt a known brand outside of india anymore. and if it is, people only know them for shitty, unreliable junk bikes.

[gizzo]

...

[fireypete]

Looking forward to giving one a test ride, but i like my shiny chromy Interceptor.  And, Royal Enfield has a good bit of heritage too. So the dream of a classic British twin is pretty much covered for me. 

[Hoiho]

royal enfield just isnt a known brand outside of india anymore. and if it is, people only know them for shitty, unreliable junk bikes.

Is that you Uncle Stu?

[justonemore]

royal enfield just isnt a known brand outside of india anymore. and if it is, people only know them for shitty, unreliable junk bikes.

Didn't think the day would come when I agreed with an opinion of yours but ... here we are.
General public outside of India don't know of the brand.
M/C enthusiasts until very recently, as you say, "only know them for shitty, unreliable junk bikes".
It took a lot of nagging from a mate to get me to test ride a RE 650 twin, I only rode one of those junkers to shut him up. Purchased one without hesitation as soon as the test ride was over.
What I didn't know was over the previous 10 years they had been slowly getting out of the 50's and joined the new world. 

[supercub]

The chrome on silver looks good. Looking at the bike from the side, the header pipe looks pretty huge.

[Kevin Mahoney]

RE has had to overcome many obstacles. Back in the day they competed with Triumph, BSA and Norton. They never had the biggest dealer base and they were not even close in sales to companies like Triumph but..... in the high school parking lot you were at the top of the heap because your bike was considered rare and some of them were damn fast.
ALL of the British bikes were unreliable by today's standards. I don't think that one was better or worse than the other. When the Japs decimated them it was because they used modern engineerin and manufacturing techniques as well as unheard of quality control.

Fast forward to India. When I started with RE, due in large part to the rapidly expanding internet India was starting to change fast enough to make your head spin. At that time they were in fact producing junk - at least as defined by most. They were using 1940's technology and early 1950's equipment. The biggest obstacle they had was that they didn't know that they were. There were literally no consumer expectations in India at that time. If you bought a toaster and it didn't work when you got home the shop owners attitude was "you shouldn't have bought that one".

Indian manufacturers including RE had no concept of what the rest of the world was doing. They only knew what they knew, nothing of the designs, manufacturing etc. from the outside world. It's really only been recently that RE has brought in outsiders in a meaningful way. The results speak for themselves

The company had been allowed to become dilapidated and had horrible management. Not bad people, but Indian culture of the time had a lot to do with it. The resistance to change was unbreakable. As we all know Eicher stepped in and started the drive towards todays modern and wonderful bikes. There is a myth about how that all happened and how RE really took off, but it has been said enough that it has become reality. I lived it, but enough said about that.

The current product stands up against anything anybody else makes and are a great value. I have been doing this for over 23 years and once thing stands true. 99% of the time when I tell people that I'm in the motorcycle business the next words from their mouths is "Harley's"? That's what the general public knows about motorcycles. Talk to a Harley rider about motorcycles and many are not familiar with most any other brands much less a niche product like the RE. I am not picking on Harley riders but only using them to illustrate a point.

They have been working hard to build name recognition by marketing but just as importantly by making tremendous bikes. If you follow RE sales you have seen a downward trend in domestic sales as more companies are building bikes to compete with them, but the bright spot is that International Sales have been increasing rapidly. If you go back 10 years the ownership of the country said that they will need to do just that to thrive and they are. RE will never have the name recognition that Harley or Honda does, but maybe that's a good thing

[whippers]

I’ve changed my mind.  I now think the use of a single is a great idea. Obviously it matches the original brand and it also offers differentiation from RE and especially Triumph. Personally i just don’t like singles much other than the specific uses where they are the most desirable power plant for weight reasons.

[Starpeve]

They're nostalgic for sure but also a blast to ride. I'd have one. I think they were pretty expensive when they were new and too many people bought into the "singles can't go on the freeway" thing. There's a few over here. Like whippers said, they're not giving them away, either.

I used to own a Suzuki Savage 650 single. It had a balance shaft and wasn't too bad for vibes. Smoother than my 535 Enfield for sure. I love bikes with the correct number of cylinders.

That "BSA" looks like a Yamaha SR500 (OK, or a Matchless G80). I'd rather have one of those. It has a history and wears it's own identity on the tank. Remember when Mahindra ran in Moto3? They weren't ashamed to put their own name on the tank when they were winning races....

Yup. Love big singles.

[NVDucati]

RE has had to overcome many obstacles. ... but maybe that's a good thing

Great sentiment and excellent observation.
I just read your bio. If you are ever out this way, stop in for a meal.

[JessHerbst]

My first exposure to Royal Enfield was the Continental GT, the 535.
 Saw it in my news feed and loved the way it looked. But then I was turned off by the single cylinder. I had always ridden inline 4s before, other than a scooter or pure dirt bike. I just couldn’t imagine putting miles on the saddle on it.
 When the 650twin came out again I was in love with the look but still hesitant about ‘only’ 2 cylinders.
 All the reviews convinced me to give it a try and its all I hoped for and more.
 I think a single cylinder 650 will be a hard sell in the U.S. maybe other countries will do better.
 Mahindra makes good products, as I’ve said I own their tractors. But will the BSA be good enough to overcome the issues of a big thumper?

[beagle]

I was going to try to put this lightly, but realized there's no way: The people that remember BSA as an actual active brand are almost all dead. While Royal Enfield is a new name to the Western market (I know the Bullet's been available here for a while, but in such small numbers as to be a unicorn.) it's already gotten a bit of recognition. I don't think either brand has a particularly huge edge over the other, but when you throw in dealer networks and the realization that there's no direct line to the OG BSA as there is with RE then Mahindra's operating at a massive disadvantage.

But, as I pointed out, both should probably be holding their breath because when Triumph launches their lower displacement Indian manufactured bikes both RE and BSA/Mahindra are going to take a massive hit.

You're correct, but we aren't all dead yet...While I enjoy a 500 classic as my go to bike for around town, Id like one of these , however the dealer network, parts distribution and servicing are a  major hurdle for any newer brand to set up.   80% of distributorship is thru a group in Australia who take on all brands simply because they have the network in place. The downside is if the sales staff in your particular store have no passion for that particular brand, you get bugger all service. Id say this is directed at the local market first as a test bed.

[Bilgemaster]

royal enfield just isnt a known brand outside of india anymore. and if it is, people only know them for shitty, unreliable junk bikes.

You're harshing my buzz and scaring the straights, 'iblastoff'. Just dial it down 2 or 3 notches and use your indoor voice to describe WHY you feel this way, OK? I mean, I grok your scene, man--totally get it, broheme. But then like, I'm an ORIGINAL BULLET masochist. But tell the tale man. Testify. Tell us how  she hurt you, man. 'Cause my Intergalactic Moderator "Reports Console" thingy is getting all Christmassy in an annoying way, too much red without enough green, dude. We need more green!

[Jack Straw]

"Dealer network, parts distribution and servicing are a  major hurdle for any newer brand to set up". 

So true, and, unfortunately I think RE is YEARS away from a professional service network.  This is precisely the reason I parked my beloved Interceptor in the corner of my shop nearly four months ago and purchased a different brand with a dedicated and established dealer in my town.

I was worried about this issue before I bought my 650 but I assumed I'd be one of the many fortunate buyers who have had no serious problem.  Well, you know what they say about assume.

I'd love to see the BSA/Mahindra venture succeed but who really thinks they'll do as good or better than RE with respect to a solid dealer and service base?

[Bilgemaster]

I’m 63 and have been riding things with two wheels and a motor since the late 1960s. (Can’t bring myself to classify my first mini bike with the Briggs & Stratton as a motorcycle).
 Until a few years ago I had never heard of Royal Enfield.
 When I’m out on my GT I frequently hear ‘Who Makes that?’, when I say ‘Royal Enfield’ the response is inevitably ‘Never heard of ‘em’.

I'd definitely classify that Briggs & Stratton wee beastie as an elemental motorbike, and give you a hearty wave as you rattled by with quarters jammed into its worn out clutch to make it move...maybe a salute too. And I concur with your notoriety assessment of Enfield. I expect that may change with these newer crops of affordable toys needing fewer concessions to modernity, as my elderly Bullet makes, but I still have my carnival barker patter on tap for the curiosi  and other starry-eyed onlookers. It's all part of the fun of ownership, right? If not, then there's no shame in a nice bland pastel Honda if you're a wallflowery sort, right? Or a nice scooter to snatch some fresh air. I adore some of those new crops of tourable scooters, like our old buddy down under Wild Bill has been showing off lately on his YouTube channel here: https://youtube.com/channel/UC5tRaoiG6vz5V-xAi91Ep4g.

[9fingers]

Some comments about some comments. The one wondering why the new bikes only have X amount of power vs their old bikes........ever heard of emissions?
And for the ones commenting on the "general public" never having heard of Royal Enfield...........sorry but the general public are generally morons. Surely you have noticed this, regardless of the subject. Is that a Harley?
As for Mahindra, like RE buying Harris so they could nail the designs of the 650 INT and GT, Mahindra purchased Pininfarina (the famous Italian design and engineering firm) around the time that they purchased BSA. AND BTW they originally were going to purchase Norton until BSA came up for sale and they grabbed that one instead. So I expect Pininfarina had more than a slight hand in the design of these bikes. There are a number of vids on youtube and the President of Classic Legends specifically noted that the engine is in a mild state of tune and more powerful versions will be coming. And I also read that they will be producing the bikes in the UK........and if the internet says so it must be true! So, they will not be cheap nor try to compete with the RE twins but will be a premium brand, and one would presume,  at a premium price. I for one love the way they look and I love thumpers! And a big thumper with counter balancing to tame vibration should be very cool. Mind you, I have ridden my Classic 500 Chrome for 10,000 miles and a couple of 1,000 trips and the vibration does not bother me, so it is possible I am a bit weird......some might say probable. Anyway, my 2 or 3 cents.
9fingers

[Bilgemaster]

As always, '9fingers' is wise. '9fingers' is good. And I hear the new BSAs are gonna be made in Coventry, at least initially, so there's that.

[Mort]

Some comments about some comments. The one wondering why the new bikes only have X amount of power vs their old bikes........ever heard of emissions?
And for the ones commenting on the "general public" never having heard of Royal Enfield...........sorry but the general public are generally morons. Surely you have noticed this, regardless of the subject. Is that a Harley?
As for Mahindra, like RE buying Harris so they could nail the designs of the 650 INT and GT, Mahindra purchased Pininfarina (the famous Italian design and engineering firm) around the time that they purchased BSA. AND BTW they originally were going to purchase Norton until BSA came up for sale and they grabbed that one instead. So I expect Pininfarina had more than a slight hand in the design of these bikes. There are a number of vids on youtube and the President of Classic Legends specifically noted that the engine is in a mild state of tune and more powerful versions will be coming. And I also read that they will be producing the bikes in the UK........and if the internet says so it must be true! So, they will not be cheap nor try to compete with the RE twins but will be a premium brand, and one would presume,  at a premium price. I for one love the way they look and I love thumpers! And a big thumper with counter balancing to tame vibration should be very cool. Mind you, I have ridden my Classic 500 Chrome for 10,000 miles and a couple of 1,000 trips and the vibration does not bother me, so it is possible I am a bit weird......some might say probable. Anyway, my 2 or 3 cents.
9fingers

I had no idea Mahindra had purchased Pininfarina. That's some interesting info.

Everything I've read said that the bikes will be produced in India, but first available for sale in the UK.

As for them being a 'premium' brand... Triumph would tell them that you can't just pull a Premium brand out of your ass. It took years before the new Triumph went from cool retro bikes with problems to earning the more premium price tag. I doubt the type of buyer who would be interested in this bike would fall for an attempt to immediately establish a new 'Premium' BSA with no actual DNA shared with the original company. Time will tell.

"Dealer network, parts distribution and servicing are a  major hurdle for any newer brand to set up". 

So true, and, unfortunately I think RE is YEARS away from a professional service network.  This is precisely the reason I parked my beloved Interceptor in the corner of my shop nearly four months ago and purchased a different brand with a dedicated and established dealer in my town.

I was worried about this issue before I bought my 650 but I assumed I'd be one of the many fortunate buyers who have had no serious problem.  Well, you know what they say about assume.

I'd love to see the BSA/Mahindra venture succeed but who really thinks they'll do as good or better than RE with respect to a solid dealer and service base?

It's always been weird to me that RE hasn't put more effort into establishing a solid dealer network. Here in Atlanta the dealer (who I really like, btw) also sells Vespas and operates out of a strip mall. They've only got enough floor space to have maybe 10 REs on the floor at a time. When the only bike that was being sold was the Bullet/Classic that was understandable, but it's insane now. In the Atlanta market, with decent advertising, $6k 650s should be flying off the shelf.

[whippers]

I guess it depends why you gravitated to these kind of bikes.  I'm too young for any British bike nostalgia.  I came into motorcycling when British bikes were already unreliable, uncompetitive relics. I knew of RE in later years but only in the sense that I know of Jawa. I didn't know anything about them other than it seemed they were just making 1950s motorbikes still for the old fogeys and some hipsters who wanted them.

I did like the look of the Continental 535 but was put off by a vibrating gutless single.  To me the twins are completely different.  A modern motorcycle with classic styling that can be a credible motorcycle for almost any use.  If you want to remember the old British days fine, if you want learner legal non Japanese bike fine, if you like me just wanted something a little less frantic to ride more often than my more highly strung machinery.

The fact that the motor is a gem and the chassis geometry is surprisedly sporty and confidence inspiring gives the twins a degree of freedom of possibility way beyond their humble spec sheet.  This is much harder to do with a single engined bike even with 45hp (5 gears, lower rev limit and necessarily taller gearing lumpier at low revs etc..) unless you love a thumper.  A reasonable chunk of this forum audience does love them but this is a very small promotion of motorcyclists.

[9fingers]

As always, '9fingers' is wise. '9fingers' is good. And I hear the new BSAs are gonna be made in Coventry, at least initially, so there's that.

Ha ha ha........got ya fooled!
9

[iblastoff]

i just read that the kerb weight of this bike is 213kg LOL. single cylinder thats even heavier than the RE650? pass.

[gizzo]

My first exposure to Royal Enfield was the Continental GT, the 535.
 Saw it in my news feed and loved the way it looked. But then I was turned off by the single cylinder.

When it's this good, you only need one cylinder. I love mine. All my bikes bar one are singles. I haven't even ridden my Ducati this year. Singles are the best (for me) horses for courses and there's something for everyone. Great to hear you came around to the twin. My bestie has an interceptor. I like riding it but I don't think I want to own one.

[Starpeve]

When it's this good, you only need one cylinder. I love mine. All my bikes bar one are singles. I haven't even ridden my Ducati this year. Singles are the best (for me) horses for courses and there's something for everyone. Great to hear you came around to the twin. My bestie has an interceptor. I like riding it but I don't think I want to own one.

I reckon you’d prefer the GT Simo. One day we’ll get around to giving you a ride on mine. And I’m with you on the singles love. I had several friends who bagged the shit out of my SR500 cafe, guess who whinged the loudest when I sold it and didn’t give them first bite? A big single, squarer the better, is a unique beast. Touches something deep inside.👍
As an aside, the Beezer appears to be shod with the Pirellis.

[gizzo]

I reckon you’d prefer the GT Simo. One day we’ll get around to giving you a ride on mine. And I’m with you on the singles love. I had several friends who bagged the shit out of my SR500 cafe, guess who whinged the loudest when I sold it and didn’t give them first bite? A big single, squarer the better, is a unique beast. Touches something deep inside.👍
As an aside, the Beezer appears to be shod with the Pirellis.

I'd love to give it a try.

[Starpeve]

Upon greater scrutiny, I’d have to say that they’ve out-retro’d Enfield by a fair margin. Right down to little bits like the piping on the seat. Chrome everywhere.
The whole ‘shape’ looks more authentic, I think it looks lovely.

[Starpeve]

I'd love to give it a try.

We’ll have to organise it. My life seems to be stabilising a little now, I’ve had a truly horrific 9 months, things appear to be on the mend, no opportunity for any fun for some time now, hopefully it’s all past. Talk soon👍

[6504me]

i just read that the kerb weight of this bike is 213kg LOL. single cylinder thats even heavier than the RE650? pass.

More chrome less plastic... how retro is that?

[iblastoff]

You're harshing my buzz and scaring the straights, 'iblastoff'. Just dial it down 2 or 3 notches and use your indoor voice to describe WHY you feel this way, OK? I mean, I grok your scene, man--totally get it, broheme. But then like, I'm an ORIGINAL BULLET masochist. But tell the tale man. Testify. Tell us how  she hurt you, man. 'Cause my Intergalactic Moderator "Reports Console" thingy is getting all Christmassy in an annoying way, too much red without enough green, dude. We need more green!

what are you even talking about? i'm referring to the general motorcycle community in north america/UK/etc. royal enfield bikes were a running joke for literal years and more, and that is if you even knew of the brand. every single review of the 535 and older bullets basically made fun of the brand, the shoddy workmanship, excessive vibes and all sorts of quality issues. remember the himalayan video when pieces literally fell off of it in its own promo video?

unfortunately that was royal enfields reputation. even royal enfield knows this. the RE650 is obviously turning a new page for them, but pretending like they didnt pump out crap bikes for probably decades is silly. that is how i knew the brand (prior to the 650s). my first experience when i bought my first gt650 didn't help, but obviously the majority of owners did not run into the catastrophic issue i had lol.

[supercub]

Harley gets badmouthed all the same, anyone who buys one gets the extended warranty, but they keep buying.

[Mort]

what are you even talking about? i'm referring to the general motorcycle community in north america/UK/etc. royal enfield bikes were a running joke for literal years and more, and that is if you even knew of the brand. every single review of the 535 and older bullets basically made fun of the brand, the shoddy workmanship, excessive vibes and all sorts of quality issues. remember the himalayan video when pieces literally fell off of it in its own promo video?

unfortunately that was royal enfields reputation. even royal enfield knows this. the RE650 is obviously turning a new page for them, but pretending like they didnt pump out crap bikes for probably decades is silly. that is how i knew the brand (prior to the 650s). my first experience when i bought my first gt650 didn't help, but obviously the majority of owners did not run into the catastrophic issue i had lol.

It's not that they made BAD bikes. They didn't. They just made the same bike for 50 years, which was fine for the Indian home market but when they started getting exported it became brutally apparent that the tech improvements since the Indian Army started having Bullets built locally in 1955 had left it in the dust.

There's a big difference between a bad vehicle and a vehicle that's not right for what it's being used for. There's also a reason why the Bullet is a legendary and popular motorcycle in India to this day. As Westerners we tend to forget that our experience is not identical to the rest of the world.

The Royal Enfield Bullet that was produced for 50 years is probably one of the most significant machines in motorcycling history. Anyone that argues against that has a pathetically Eurocentric view of the world.

Your argument about the Himalayan is foolish as well. Yeah, the foot peg breaking off wasn't a good look, but it was a foot peg. It wasn't a frame fracturing. A lot of pre-production bikes are put together with spit and bailing wire. The Himmie is a damn solid bike if you don't want a lot of features and don't need to go over 70mph.

I will never understand why you put so much effort posting on a forum dedicated to a company that you seem to hate. It's definitely not making you popular. LoL.

[zimmemr]

what are you even talking about? i'm referring to the general motorcycle community in north america/UK/etc. royal enfield bikes were a running joke for literal years and more, and that is if you even knew of the brand. every single review of the 535 and older bullets basically made fun of the brand, the shoddy workmanship, excessive vibes and all sorts of quality issues. remember the himalayan video when pieces literally fell off of it in its own promo video?

unfortunately that was royal enfields reputation. even royal enfield knows this. the RE650 is obviously turning a new page for them, but pretending like they didnt pump out crap bikes for probably decades is silly. that is how i knew the brand (prior to the 650s). my first experience when i bought my first gt650 didn't help, but obviously the majority of owners did not run into the catastrophic issue i had lol.

Blastoff has a point. In 1999 I was working for a magazine called Road Bike. In March of that year I was sent to Miami to cover the launch of the Kawasaki Drifter, and from there to Daytona to cover the race. During race week a group of us were invited to accompany Mr Mahoney on a day's ride. It sounded like fun and I thought the Bullet 350, which is all that were available to us, seemed sort of interesting so off I went.

 Long story short: I blew the crank clean out of the one I was riding, and the rest of the journos, I think there were 12 of us, reported numerous mechanical issues. No one was terribly impressed, at least not in a good way, so I can see where Blastoff is coming from and like it or not he has a point.

Fast forward to around 2012 (I think) now working for Motorcycle Cruiser Magazine I was asked to do a long term 5K miles (at least) test of the Classic 500. The bike was absolutely trouble free over 7500 test miles and in a direct way led to me eventually buying both a Himalayan and an Interceptor, both of which have been dead reliable since day one.

Obviously RE has made a huge turnaround in quality, but having said that I can also tell you that when I tell friends of mine in the industry what I'm spending my own money on these days the result is still the same, a raised eyebrow, and comments to the effect that "I've heard they make a decent bike these days." So while Blastoff and I may have differing opinions on the current crop of RE's his comments regarding prior versions are perfectly understandable and in my opinion have some validity.

[Starpeve]

what are you even talking about? i'm referring to the general motorcycle community in north america/UK/etc. royal enfield bikes were a running joke for literal years and more, and that is if you even knew of the brand. every single review of the 535 and older bullets basically made fun of the brand, the shoddy workmanship, excessive vibes and all sorts of quality issues. remember the himalayan video when pieces literally fell off of it in its own promo video?

unfortunately that was royal enfields reputation. even royal enfield knows this. the RE650 is obviously turning a new page for them, but pretending like they didnt pump out crap bikes for probably decades is silly. that is how i knew the brand (prior to the 650s). my first experience when i bought my first gt650 didn't help, but obviously the majority of owners did not run into the catastrophic issue i had lol.

They had merely continued for the most part in turning out basically the same bikes with their old tooling, servicing the local market.

[whippers]

Yes I’m with iblastoff in this one.  Loving the bullet outside of India is a niche experience. The only products that have mass appeal are the new twins.  The Himalayan was a step forward but is too compromised for most people.  Again if you like the Himalayan or bullet go you. I’m just arguing what the situation is from a market perspective.  It is the same with the single love, you are mostly on your own despite the proportion who feel that way on this forum.  It is hard to be objective when everyone around you feels the same way but you need to try.

[Warwick]

Bullet quality was almost ok. the issue was people bought them and thought they could be used on modern freeways and could keep up with modern bikes. They couldn't as they had a floating bush big end and other out dated technology. Owners wondered why they blew up when flogged, and off course, blamed the bike. I know a guy who rode one on a freeway on the way home after purchase and wondered why it seized. Hadn't even been run in which was essential on a 50's bike

[Kes61]

Having seen this in the flesh on face value it looked good. The style is great the seat height is good for the vertically challenged.
Then on looking deeper the rad is a no and the rad cap is off a pop bottle. The rad expansiion tank sits at the front rammed by the swinging arm pivot. The regulator rectifier is under the middle of the sump. The exhaust downpipe has a sheild all the way down it which makes it look beefy, then just on the bottom bend of the header it branches off into a catalyst at the bottom of the frame rail. This is with some lumpy painted welds ready to rust up.
Would I have one, yes, would I have one as my only bike no.

[Blazes Boylan]

The 650s are still niche bikes, despite the number of compliments I get on my Interceptor.  (It drew a small untutored crowd in Williamsburg last night.  Someone asked me if it was a Ducati.)  I don't know how big a market there is for a 47hp (ahem) air-cooled motorcycle.  The GT and Interceptor win on style--witness the Geico commercial--but the low power tends to be a deal breaker.  We can all testify to how much pleasure there is to be had from a slow motorcycle but new riders tend to look at performance numbers and opt for a Bonneville or Ninja.  I'm rooting for the company but on the other hand I don't particularly want to see a flood of Royal Enfields on the road.  I like the idea of riding a niche bike.

[Pitch]

The 650s are still niche bikes, despite the number of compliments I get on my Interceptor.  (It drew a small untutored crowd in Williamsburg last night.  Someone asked me if it was a Ducati.)  I don't know how big a market there is for a 47hp (ahem) air-cooled motorcycle.  The GT and Interceptor win on style--witness the Geico commercial--but the low power tends to be a deal breaker.  We can all testify to how much pleasure there is to be had from a slow motorcycle but new riders tend to look at performance numbers and opt for a Bonneville or Ninja.  I'm rooting for the company but on the other hand I don't particularly want to see a flood of Royal Enfields on the road.  I like the idea of riding a niche bike.

This is the dilemma! I always talk up my interceptor when people inevitably ask questions about it, but I don't want to see them everywhere, it's nice having a niche bike with loads of character.

[JessHerbst]

This is the dilemma! I always talk up my interceptor when people inevitably ask questions about it, but I don't want to see them everywhere, it's nice having a niche bike with loads of character.

Everyone just thinks I ride a really well restored old motorcycle!

[gizzo]

We’ll have to organise it. My life seems to be stabilising a little now, I’ve had a truly horrific 9 months, things appear to be on the mend, no opportunity for any fun for some time now, hopefully it’s all past. Talk soon👍

Great to hear your on the up side. Well done. I'm thinking about going for a breakfast run to Gumeracha on Saturday. You're welcome to come along if you want to...

[Suncoast]

The Missendenflyer posted a walk around of the BSA here- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfMS-S4_G6c&t=142s  looks nice, I wonder if the Brembo calipers might fit our Enfields?

[Starpeve]

Great to hear your on the up side. Well done. I'm thinking about going for a breakfast run to Gumeracha on Saturday. You're welcome to come along if you want to...

What time and where? If I’m able I’m keen. What pony are you riding? Maybe we could do a swap sometime during the ride?

[gizzo]

What time and where? If I’m able I’m keen. What pony are you riding? Maybe we could do a swap sometime during the ride?

ill shoot you a PM

[20MarkIII]

Blastoff has a point. In 1999 I was working for a magazine called Road Bike. In March of that year I was sent to Miami to cover the launch of the Kawasaki Drifter, and from there to Daytona to cover the race. During race week a group of us were invited to accompany Mr Mahoney on a day's ride. It sounded like fun and I thought the Bullet 350, which is all that were available to us, seemed sort of interesting so off I went.

 Long story short: I blew the crank clean out of the one I was riding, and the rest of the journos, I think there were 12 of us, reported numerous mechanical issues. No one was terribly impressed, at least not in a good way, so I can see where Blastoff is coming from and like it or not he has a point.

Fast forward to around 2012 (I think) now working for Motorcycle Cruiser Magazine I was asked to do a long term 5K miles (at least) test of the Classic 500. The bike was absolutely trouble free over 7500 test miles and in a direct way led to me eventually buying both a Himalayan and an Interceptor, both of which have been dead reliable since day one.

Obviously RE has made a huge turnaround in quality, but having said that I can also tell you that when I tell friends of mine in the industry what I'm spending my own money on these days the result is still the same, a raised eyebrow, and comments to the effect that "I've heard they make a decent bike these days." So while Blastoff and I may have differing opinions on the current crop of RE's his comments regarding prior versions are perfectly understandable and in my opinion have some validity.

This old mare from the stable should look familiar to you then. Don't ride her much now with the RE's getting the attention but still love the bike!

[dickim]

Met up with friends for lunch, mentioned the GT and then sent him a pic - below is his response- bear in mind 67yr old Aussie of Croatian heritage, and NEVER ridden, so interesting what his thoughts were..

Our pleasure having you guys 😊
The bike 🏍 is different to what I pictured... better! Very nice 👍🏽
Reminds me a little of  a Norton or BSA (pipes and styling).
Again.. nice bike!
😊