Author Topic: Speedometer broke  (Read 348 times)

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mtrue77

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on: October 04, 2021, 03:55:01 pm
I noticed my speedometer needle had been bouncing around more than usual a month ago, so l went through the process of lubricating the cable a couple weeks ago.  I scheduled some time with the guys I bought this from in Ohio, and rode up there last Sunday.  2009 Bullet, AVL.  I had some issues (noises) I wanted to discuss with them, as well as some general maintenance question.  One of them rode around the neighborhood (somewhat rural area), and came back with good info. 

I was so cold on the way up that I thought I would freeze.  The whole time, I was saying to myself, "This was a mistake. This was a mistake.  This was a mistake."  Twenty miles into a 150-mile round trip, my speedometer and odometer stopped working.  Something else to ask about.  The air temp had warmed a lot by the the time I headed home, and there were no more loud noises, so it was a nice ride.  Very windy, though.  Pretty sure I saw whitecaps on the Ohio as I neared Pittsburgh.

So, the guy gave me a couple used speedometers to try out.  One has about 4800 miles on it.  Black face.  The other, as he pointed out, has no miles on it.  It has a white face.  I think it looks nicer, and will be easier to read.  And I've got no problem multiplying by .6 as I go along.

I haven't started the project, yet.  I have things to move around, and not much room.  Any idea what kind of plug I'm likely to encounter?  The black-faced speedometer has two plugs, and the other one has a single plug.  Same number of contacts, and the wires are all color coded the same.  Just wondering if I should anticipate having to cut and splice wires before I get into it.  Maybe I could make up the proper harness before leaving the basement.

And I'm assuming the problem isn't in that unit mounted on the axle.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2021, 04:18:47 pm by mtrue77 »
Michael T
Pittsburgh, PA
2009 AVL


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Reply #1 on: October 04, 2021, 04:30:35 pm
Quote
And I'm assuming the problem isn't in that unit mounted on the axle.

While you have the speedo off, checking the cable and the drive unit on the rear axle will be easy enough with the bike on the center stand. If the drive itself needs to come off, be grateful for the Q/D rear axle.

With the right tool you an un-pick the 2.8mm terminals from the 9-way connector block on the new speedo as well as the two separate connector blocks on your old speedo and swap them over if the wires themselves match up. Maybe draw a sketch of the wires' order?

A.
Grumpy Brit still seeking 500 AVL Bullet perfection! Will let you know if I get anywhere near...


Bilgemaster

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Reply #2 on: October 04, 2021, 04:56:56 pm
I'm not saying the problem ISN'T the speedo unit. They have been known to go bad. But the likelier culprits are the cable followed by the chintsy plastic drive unit.
So badass my Enfield's actually illegal  in India.

 


mtrue77

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Reply #3 on: October 04, 2021, 05:20:06 pm
Thank you, Bilgemaster.

By the way, that speedometer drive unit is here on my front axle.
Michael T
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Reply #4 on: October 04, 2021, 07:18:24 pm
Sorry, yes, I was in Redditch mode, there! Speedo drives made out of er... some sort of metal are still available from India if a plastic one is too fragile.

A.
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mtrue77

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Reply #5 on: October 04, 2021, 08:41:40 pm
Thank you, again.  Just found this in my box of stuff.  I think I replaced this 9 or 10 years ago.  I remember the guy I ordered it from (in Minnesota?) said it was pretty unusual that I had to replace it twice.
Michael T
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2009 AVL


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Reply #6 on: October 04, 2021, 11:41:37 pm
Yup, that's the Indian plastic copy of the Indian metal copy of the original Smith's speedometer drive, as **previously** fitted to the rear wheel. Not sure why Enfield India moved it to the front.

I just checked my earlier statement, the metal version IS still available. You might even find a low-mileage genuine Smiths 2:1 at a local swap meet, but check the spindle hole size.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/265312521224?hash=item3dc5dbcc08:g:OpsAAOSwdPBZ2ybU

A.
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Bilgemaster

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Reply #7 on: October 05, 2021, 04:39:24 pm

The good news is that even if you're OK getting by with the craptastic plastic speedo drive, and are in no particular hurry, last time I looked they were like 79 cents delivered off eBay from "yonder". Well, maybe not that cheap, but less than a six pack of Yuenglings, anyhow--cheap enough to enrage Norton, Triumph or BSA owners. And my plastic one's still hanging in there fine, knock wood. Just grease 'em up really well, preferably with the same waterproof goop folks use in boat trailer wheel bearings. But seriously, most any grease'll do better than none, even, you know...


And here's another fun bacon grease lifehack: Got a neighbor whose dog keeps crapping in your yard? Just pour a little bacon grease on those turds and watch 'em disappear next time he comes around. It's always a treat for the owner too, watching his mutt chow down. Just call out "Bone Appetit!" now and then, and they'll soon change the route of their perambulations.
So badass my Enfield's actually illegal  in India.

 


mtrue77

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Reply #8 on: October 06, 2021, 01:11:28 pm
Thank you for the info and the link, Bilgemaster.  This past year, I bought a couple of items from Hitchcock (air filter and oil filters), and about 25 years ago, I bought something from Scotland for my daughter.  So, it's not like I have no experience with international commerce.  However, I'm a little skeptical of EBay India.  Actually, I'm already a little skeptical of EBay.  I've always pictured it as similar to Craig's List (people selling things they found in their basement).  In your experience, is eBay India a good source for parts?

I only recently became aware of WesternCycleSupply dot com in Texas.  They don't have the parts I would buy from them, though.

I once saw a Redbone Coonhound (Hank) come out of the woods with a mixture of fallen leaves and horse poop in his mouth.

When I look on eBay, I'm seeing prices from $10 to $20, plastic or metal, and that seems reasonable.  The ads also show "free shipping" from India.  How can free shipping from India be legitimate, even if it's a 79-cent part with $9 added for shipping?   
« Last Edit: October 06, 2021, 01:36:47 pm by mtrue77 »
Michael T
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2009 AVL


Bilgemaster

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Reply #9 on: October 06, 2021, 03:17:23 pm
As I've mentioned in these Forums before, I'd had some luck getting this or that non-critical nicknack off eBay from India or China paying with PayPal, so I could get my money back if the doodads either never arrived and had "gone where the windbine twineth" or were nonfunctional on arrival (very often the case with those cheapo Bluetooth wireless earbuds I favor). But certainly in the case of Indian vendors this was all Pre-Covid, and I understand their shipping services and other supply lines yonder have really been clobbered by the Wuhan bug, with reports of formerly reasonably reliable vendors going pretty much dark, failing even to respond to inquiries. So yeah, always pay with PayPal, mind the promised delivery date, and the second it passes with no arrival of the promised item, file a refund claim with eBay. It is quite easy to do. Do not rescind the claim under any circumstances should the vendor request it. That'll only make it FAR more difficult for you to initiate a subsequent claim.

As for that whole free or ultra-cheap shipping thing, this is thanks to arguably over-favorable agreements hammered out nation-to-nation under something called The International Postal Union. As so-called "Developing Nations" both China (the 2nd largest economy on the globe) and India enjoy what has amounted to free shipping-to-door once their packages hit our shore, though China now has to pay a revised dime per each. I'll bet a vendor in Toledo or New York would like to be able to ship their doodads to LA for a dime, huh? And not being able to do so puts them at a MASSIVE disadvantage. I once explained the situation in some detail on a sailing forum I also subscribe to here: https://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=25906&p=320818&hilit=Postage#p320818.

Suffice it to say, we're being a bit dumb, particularly in the case of China, whose government bears us little good will. All they have to do is beach their crap on our shining shores aboard their 100% government subsidized freighters, and YOU pay for the rest of the delivery. Yes. YOU...Every time you send a letter part of that postage is a subsidy to keep those Chinese Wheels of Industry turning.

« Last Edit: October 06, 2021, 03:24:54 pm by Bilgemaster »
So badass my Enfield's actually illegal  in India.

 


mtrue77

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Reply #10 on: October 20, 2021, 02:49:20 am
Today I finally got around to installing a new (to me) speedometer.  My guys in Ohio had given me (besides the two used speedometers) a tip on how to get the frame that holds the headlight out of the way so I could see what I was doing.  The first thing i noticed was that the nut that holds the cable into the back of the speedometer was mostly off.  I had released it a few weeks ago when I tried to lube the cable.  I had put it back on mostly by feel because I hadn't removed the headlight.

I thought, "That's the problem right there."  I tightened the nut, buttoned everything back up, and went for a ride around the block.  Nothing.  So, I took everything apart again and got ready to install the speedometer with the matching plug.   Before that, I pulled the cable out of the drive, and chucked it into my drill.  I pulled the trigger (drill running in reverse), and I got the needle up to 50 mph.  So, I think I know three things: my original speedometer is probably OK, the cable is OK, and the drive unit is no good.  If that's the case, I think this will be the third time I've replaced it.  The first two being 10 or 12 years ago. 

I found a metal one (from your link) and a plastic one, both on EBay, and I ordered them both.  Expected in a month or two.

I also sent an email to Hitchcock.  Their website shows they have one that fits all units with drum brakes, but a chart on the same page says it doesnt fit Electra(x) which I thought I was supposed to use for ordering parts.   Mine is 2009 Bullet Classic w/ AVL "lean burn" engine.  Drum brakes font and back.
Michael T
Pittsburgh, PA
2009 AVL


mtrue77

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Reply #11 on: October 20, 2021, 01:22:14 pm
This is the response I got from Hitchcock:

Hello there,

It sounds like your bike is an Indian home market bike that was never officially available here in the UK, the drum brake and disc brake bikes use different diameter front spindles, so they are not interchangeable. If your bike has a drum front brake then the central hole in the speedo drive should be 16.50 – 16.75mm diameter, the disc brake one is exactly the same design but has a central hole of 17.00 – 17.10mm, remove yours, measure it to double check what is fitted to your bike;

Drum brake - https://accessories.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/accessory-shop/instruments/18402

Disc brake - https://accessories.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/accessory-shop/Speedometer-Gearbox/19268
.........
I don't think I have an "Indian home market bike" in that I bought it fron a dealer in Hubbard, OH in 2008 a few years before Royal Enfield took away all the little dealerships.  Anyway, I'll be measuring my speedometer drive this morning, hoping my Harbor Freight caliper is more accurate than .5mm.
Michael T
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2009 AVL


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Reply #12 on: October 20, 2021, 01:55:28 pm
Sadly, as i have mentioned before, Hitchcock's don't always have a handle on what models were sold OUTSIDE of the UK.

Thus the AVL Classic, which was never an official UK import, is not on their radar, and they don't have an on-line parts book for one. You have to play mix and match with the Electra-X parts book for engine, gearbox and primary transmission while reverting to the 4 speed E/S Bullet for all the cycle parts.

Quite possibly, by the time Kevin Mahoney had arranged for RE India to supply the US market with the AVL Classic, the previous UK importers had had the last of the pre-Euro 3 models shipped over and couldn't import anything made after 2007 unless it was an EFI model. Perhaps they should have anticipated the resistance to the Electra-X's styling sooner, as there have been a few which have been converted to traditional Bullet styling by their owners over here.

A.
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mtrue77

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Reply #13 on: October 20, 2021, 03:34:38 pm
My dial caliper tells me 63 hundredths plus about a third.  That translates to 16mm and maybe half a hair.  Not quite in the range, but it's not like I need to measure anything to know drum brakes when I see 'em.  Nothing against Indian manufacturing, but the tolerance quoted by Hitchcock seems greater than what you'd find in gardening tools here.  Maybe I'm wrong. 
« Last Edit: October 20, 2021, 03:38:40 pm by mtrue77 »
Michael T
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mtrue77

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Reply #14 on: October 25, 2021, 02:18:37 pm
Isn't this how they package heroin?  At least on the TV shows I've seen.

 FedEx just dropped this off.  Pretty nice, since I wasn't really expecting it until late next month.  Anyways, here's my next project.  Unheated backyard shed, so I should probably start soon.  By the way, the diameter of the hole looks about 16.5mm.

It's a little rough looking, but it says "Super Quality" right on it.  So, there's that.
Michael T
Pittsburgh, PA
2009 AVL