[Guardsman_Miku]

Hi there

My 2016 500 Classic EFI has started making this tik tik sound from the top of the engine, I will attach a short video to demonstrate. It is very noticeable while idling, but mostly goes away when you rev the engine.

I've done a lot of research and as far as I understand this is either to do with damaged hydraulic tappets (which I understand), or something to do with the cams or the rockers (which I don't). I have just done a oil change to see if that was the issue but it doesn't seem to have worked unfortunately.

Anyway, I suppose my main question is how much of an issue is this? I've seen a lot of people who seem to be suggesting they've done thousands of miles under these conditions, I can't tell if people are talking about it because its annoying or if its actually damaging the engine.

Unfortunately I'm supposed to be going on a big motorcycle trip on sunday, so i basically need to decide in the next day or so if i need to cancel or not.

[SteveThackery]

My UCE 500 Bullet made the most appalling mechanical din even from new. The Indians managed to make the hydraulic tappets make more clickety racket than the manually adjusted ones of earlier models. Good knows how they managed that.

They also invented the worst automatic decompressor I've ever seen in my life. I disabled it within a week or collecting the bike. It is totally unnecessary anyway.

So, the noise you can hear might just be what that engine does, but you might want to check out the decompressor in case it is getting hyperactive and engaging - or partially engaging - at speeds near idle.

I'm sure there'll be other suggestions coming along soon.

[Silverback]

My UCE 500 Bullet made the most appalling mechanical din even from new. The Indians managed to make the hydraulic tappets make more clickety racket than the manually adjusted ones of earlier models. Good knows how they managed that.

They also invented the worst automatic decompressor I've ever seen in my life. I disabled it within a week or collecting the bike. It is totally unnecessary anyway.

So, the noise you can hear might just be what that engine does, but you might want to check out the decompressor in case it is getting hyperactive and engaging - or partially engaging - at speeds near idle.

I'm sure there'll be other suggestions coming along soon.

I just replaced my fro t sprocket and putback together. I was thinking of taking off the decompressor but left it on. I wish I would have looked at this post.lol... maybe  I take the case off.

I went through trying to hunt down the ticking sound. I finally just got used to it. Yes the lifters are hydraulic so that rules adjustment out. Cam gear back lash was dead on so there really wasn't anything else to look at.  The bike is running great and now the sound is a part of its character..  the above quoted post characterizes the bike bike well.

It's not a modern bike by any means. The J and 650 platforms are. But this bike is so easy to work on and own it has a special place in my heart.

[Blackdog62]

Mines started doing exactly the same I checked everything cam gear backlash re set and fitted an anti vibration plate and as a precaution carried out a service righthand side cover was already off so replaced the oil pump 'O' ring and 15/50 fully synthetic oil the novice has got worse over the last week and now the ticking noise is almost constant, I considering removing the decompression device or setting it to be continually deactivated the tick tick seems to be coming from the exhaust valve, any advice on this would be greatly appreciated.
The bike has covered 14K miles but I guess these had been fine with local riding unfortunately I do greater distances on motorways and back roads the bikes been a joy until this noise has started its becoming very frustrating to say the least today I've re checked everything again including turning the engine over with the plug out and the valve covers off to check oil is getting up to the top end and it's fine the rocker arms seem fine as do the push rods, I'm lost now so if someone can point me in another direction I'd really appreciate any advice

[Haggis]

Maybe just a tired hydraulic lifter not holding full pressure?  Try a screwdriver under the rocker arm and try and lever the arm down against the lifter. It should not move.

[Blackdog62]

Thanks haggis I've tried this screwdriver thing and I can compress the valve spring without moving the rocker arm so I think the lifters are fortunately okay, I did take out the decompression mechanism and put it all back together with no alteration in the noise which I found very strange, so this morning I have stripped the whole right hand side off the bike again so I have the cams in my hands, I've checked the rollers on the lifters just incase they are the issue but all seems well so got out my micrometer, and measured the decompression cam rod it measures axactly 3.8mm as stamped on the rod, however the hole in the cam measures 4mm exactly now the bike was second hand and originally it was really quiet I'm not sure how it had been ridden up until my ownership but let's just say I don't potter around but I also don't thrash it in every gear I did pop it on the motorway when all this started and it topped out at an indicated 75mph 80 down hill, I'm wondering if the decompression rod has been wrong all along as when the hydraulic lifter runs over the flat (decompression off) there's a 0.1mm drop into the slot this is eve dent when I press on the flat is moves down into the slot creating a step for the lifter to catch on and this might be the issue?
I've ordered the 4.0mm decompression rod from HC and will keep you all posted on my findings, before anyone starts saying there's no load on this erea of the cam well there's enough oil pressure to push the lifter down into the slot and as my noise is worse the more revs I give it I think this might be the case, the oil flow is great and the top of the valves get a nice flow of oil just cranking over on the e start so tick over should be great and as I said the noise had gotten worse once I'd serviced the bike so new oil seals on the crank input shaft and on the pump outlet will give great pressure probably more than before the service sort of proving my theory, but let's see how it goes I'm wondering if quite a lot of these issues are simply the wrong size rod fitted into the exhaust cam

[SteveThackery]

I have to say, @Guardsman_Miku's recording sounds so much better than my 2014 UCE ever did.

@Blackdog62: I doubt that the wrong pins were fitted from new, although of course it is possible.  Do please let us know the results of your experiment.

When I first saw how the decomp worked I was horrified! It's a really harsh lump for the cam follower to negotiate, and its design is horribly crude. I disabled mine immediately, although even then there is still this little dip even in the inactive position that has been mentioned already.  I think the proper cure would be to weld it up and regrind, but it would be far too expensive, I expect.

I don't know why it is even fitted - it is certainly completely unnecessary for starting.  There was a theory that it helped prevent damage to the starter sprag clutch when the engine bounces off compression as it comes to a halt. But that's not a good reason - those early sprag failures were due to a crap design and were fixed by fitting the later, revised, sprag clutch.  Also, loads of bikes kick the starter motor when they stop (including my Meteor and my Mandello), and yet their sprag clutches survive just fine.

I just have to assume that RE were having a bad day when they decided the UCE needed a decomp.

[axman88]

The fellow at NCR Motorcycles on UTube takes us through diagnosis and repair of head noise resulting from a worn valve guide in this video:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUrOIk7Fkq0

Here we see a collapsed lifter being revealed:   https://www.youtube.com/shorts/o3xgTbtvwy8

And Mono Sagar takes us through the process of pulling a hydraulic lifter:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b25BdqAZLWA

How many kilometers or miles on your 2016?

[Haggis]

The roller on the hydraulic lifters do not drop into the slot where the pin is.
The roller runs about one third on the cam and two thirds over the decompresor pin.
So when the pin is flat the roller is always running on the cam.

[SteveThackery]

The roller on the hydraulic lifters do not drop into the slot where the pin is.
The roller runs about one third on the cam and two thirds over the decompresor pin.
So when the pin is flat the roller is always running on the cam.

Ah, yes, I remember now. Dreadful design.

[Haggis]

Blackdog62,

I had a look at a spare engine I have and pulled the cams out for a look.
There is very slight marking where the lifter roller runs on the cam, nothing you can feel though.
The decompresor pin only lifts the exhaust lifter by 30 thou of a inch.
You can see in the picture how the roller runs on the cam.
Have you checked the endfoat on your cams.
There should be a shim washer on the outside of each cam before the triangular plate is screwed on.
Even then there is a fair bit of play on mine.
Possibly fit more than one shim to reduce the endfoat of the cams maybe reduce your noise?


Bellow is the pin in the raised position.

[SteveThackery]

Possibly fit more than one shim to reduce the endfoat of the cams maybe reduce your noise?

I did that on mine. Reduced the end float to the absolute minimum, but I'm not sure if it really helped.  Might as well do it, though.