[tooseevee]

       I brought this from Campfire Talk & renamed it.

       Here's what I'm doing (should have done it years ago when I got the seat) to get my feet flatter on the ground. I canNOT be tippy-toed any more and keep riding.

       Photo 1: This is the factory seat mount. It is not conducive to after market seat brackets. The main battery frame ground bolt limits how low I can weld the tube on and I can't see moving it and more welding. But.

          Photo 2:  This is how my seat bracket WAS mounted. It's pretty much the ONLY way it can go. You have to jam the nut with a screwdriver because the ground bung keeps a wrench out. It's just overall a PITA!

          Photo 3: This is where the tube will be welded after it's cut loose from the angled piece. It can only go so low because of the ground bolt. Then I'll grind the mount at an angle from the tube back to suit where the seat wants to be.

           The wires are easily protected from welding heat and the one wire going though the frame mount will be moved. I had previously taken the main harness out of there when I unwrapped the whole harness years ago.

            The tank will be removed.

            I'm still conSIDering cutting the whole thing off the frame, mounting the ground bung somewhere else and welding the tube directly to the frame. THAT would get me aNOTHER inch  I'm thinking how hard it would be on my hands to shape that piece of steel to the frame.

       What think ye?

[heloego]

Had you considered relocating the battery ground to another location, like a lug for the battery support on the rear down tube?

[tooseevee]

Had you considered relocating the battery ground to another location, like a lug for the battery support on the rear down tube?

           Read my text again 

[heloego]

Quote: "...and the one wire going though the frame mount will be moved."
Point made. 

[tooseevee]

Quote: "...and the one wire going though the frame mount will be moved."
Point made. 

           No, that's not the sentence I was referring to (and the "one wire" that's inside that damn horseshoe isn't the Main ground wire).

           Anyway   The sentence I meant is the very last one where I say I was still actively thinking of all the ins and outs of cutting the whole thing off, welding the tube directly to the frame and relocating the main frame ground.

           I can't remember for sure, but I think that one wire goes to the starter relay in the left side case & is no huge deal to pull out of there when I decide to cut that bracket off (just to be sure I don't cut it while I'm cutting the bracket off).

           I HAVE to be sure FIRST that my welder friend will make a "house call" before I cut anything & I can't get over to see him with pictures of what I want done until Tues. or maybe Wed.. Finishing this drywell job in my back yard is taking precedence right now. Finished surrounding it with gravel yesterday and finished filling the trench and spreading top soil & will get the Pop-Top standpipe done this morning. Then I'll get the final topsoil spread over the drywell itself. Last step will be seeding it and THEN I can concentrate on the bike.

            Your suggestion to find another existing bolt for the ground is perfect. Why did I think of Welding first?  Keep an eye on me  I'm distracted 

               

[AzCal Retred]

2CV - put the ground from the bat(-) to a nearby engine case bolt, use a #2 or so if you can find a suitable black cable from the auto supply. That'll cover the starter amps plenty. Put a #8 or so ring-lugged jumper from there up to the regular "wad 'o grounds" from the wiring harness, long enough so you don't need to chop up anything. Bolt the jumper & the regular grounds together, add a little black 3M "33" any it's invulnerable. -ACR -

[tooseevee]

2CV - put the ground from the bat(-) to a nearby engine case bolt, use a #2 or so if you can find a suitable black cable from the auto supply. That'll cover the starter amps plenty. Put a #8 or so ring-lugged jumper from there up to the regular "wad 'o grounds" from the wiring harness, long enough so you don't need to chop up anything. Bolt the jumper & the regular grounds together, add a little black 3M "33" any it's invulnerable. -ACR -

           I couldn't leave it alone & went down an hour ago even though I didn't feel like it. Once I got down there I was OK  . I used the bolt that holds the cute little rubber fuse holder to the cross member. A few minutes getting good bare metal with a Dremel sandpaper drum and it was done. The factory main ground wire is heavy & already has a good Ring connector on it. No need for a new wire & the bolt goes plenty tight. All done.

    Now I can cut the horseshoe off right across even with the top surface of the frame tube. That will create three good weld points (the remaining pieces of the horseshoe still welded to the frame tube and the frame tube).  Very simple very easy.

    That will give me the lowest possible mounting for that tube. The other picture shows the "increase in lowness" I'll get.

     Tomorrow I'll go see my welder guy and buy grass seed  and then the drywell will be done.


 

[AzCal Retred]

What about cross drilling the "horse shoe" bracket vertical sides to accept the pivot sleeve, or skipping the sleeve & using only a shouldered bolt through this bracket to to support the seat pivot? Side slack could be made up with washers. A Nyloc nut would handle tensioning chores & stay put for adjustment. Some really good Grade #8 fine thread bolts out there. 

Using a bolt smaller in diameter than the sleeve automatically drops you even a bit lower. Nothing in this option precludes later welding, and you wouldn't need to wait on anyone else. A grinder would easily remove any surplus metal. Plus, you are not accidentally subjecting any electronics to welding current or arc splash.

Just a thought - ACR -

[tooseevee]

What about cross drilling the "horse shoe" bracket vertical sides to accept the pivot sleeve, or skipping the sleeve & using only a shouldered bolt through this bracket to to support the seat pivot? Side slack could be made up with washers. A Nyloc nut would handle tensioning chores & stay put for adjustment. Some really good Grade #8 fine thread bolts out there. 

Using a bolt smaller in diameter than the sleeve automatically drops you even a bit lower. Nothing in this option precludes later welding, and you wouldn't need to wait on anyone else. A grinder would easily remove any surplus metal. Plus, you are not accidentally subjecting any electronics to welding current or arc splash.

Just a thought - ACR -

        I can't leave ANY part of the "horseshoe" as the seat bracket itself is such that it will not "drop down over" the horseshoe (the horseshoe is wider than the seat bracket) so would still remain higher than I want it IOW I don't gain enough to even bother.

           I was already committed to removing the whole thing anyway. There's very little spatter with TIG and everything will be covered with Refrasil.  The battery will be disconnected.

           So. I finally got to go see my welder friend Friday (life interfered with getting there) & he's coming Thursday so I spent 10 minutes twice yesterday and the horseshoe is gone, cut off even with the top of the center frame tube leaving the two stubs of the horseshoe to weld to + the frame tube. This will place the tube for the seat bracket WAY lower than before, as you can see from the previous pictures, making this whole exercise worth the trouble.

          Today I'll cut the tube loose from its little bracket and my part will be done.   

[chuntera]

Can you modify the seat to lower height ?

[tooseevee]

Can you modify the seat to lower height ?

           No. It's a very minimalist Chica style seat. It has almost zero padding. It's just black leather over a steel seat pan with maybe a half inch of "something" for padding.

            I don't have recent pictures of the Enfield, but here's the same seat on the last harley I built.

[axman88]

The way my Classic 500, with it's stock vinyl over foam over steel pan seat arrived as I purchased it 2nd hand, was with a very crude bracket attached to the bottom of the seat.  That bracket was just a simple offset bent piece of steel, bolted to the bottom of the seat pan.  The offset leg went through the open "U" which is welded to the frame.  There was no fore and aft fixing of the seat at the front.  The seat was mounted at the rear via the usual springs and sloped downward towards the tank.  The rear springs pushed the seat forward as well as holding the back end up, which kept the offset prong engaged with the frame stirrup.  It was crude, and I figured it was either an owner mod, or a dealer mod, to get lower saddle height.

Being about 6'1", I wanted MORE seat height, so I purchased and installed the standard front hinge bracket mount.

Could one not cut the stirrup off the frame and weld the static hinge knuckle directly to the frame, thus lowering the front of the seat by over 1"?  Not sure how fastener access would be?

[tooseevee]

Could one not cut the stirrup off the frame and weld the static hinge knuckle directly to the frame, thus lowering the front of the seat by over 1"?  Not sure how fastener access would be?

       I don't get it. Haven't you read what I've been doing? That's exactly what I'm doing. And I get a bit more than 2" lower, not 1". Look at the pictures I've so conscientiously posted 

       I'll take a few more tonight to bring you up to date 

       It's all done now but welding the tube to the frame and that's happening Thursday morning. A welding "house call" like the doctors did when I was growing up in the '40s and '50s. He's an old friend whose father I worked with in the '60s and he has a thriving welding business now.

[axman88]

       I don't get it. Haven't you read what I've been doing? That's exactly what I'm doing. And I get a bit more than 2" lower, not 1". Look at the pictures I've so conscientiously posted 

Yeah, I was reading.   Lots of words.  And I looked at the pictures, which all seem to show the barrel of the knuckle well above the stirrup, which is well above the frame, and none of them showed it down where it would end up if you cut off the stirrup.  Seems like somebody could just drill a cross hole in the stirrup and call THAT drill hole in a couple sheet metal thicknesses the mount, or drill bigger, and weld in a piece of tube, or even swage both ends of a tube so it couldn't slip out the sides of a drilled hole in the stirrup, and be finished.

Or, there was the cheap and crude method the previous owner of my bike used.  I rode it that way for a while, but I improved matters by shoving a couple of pieces of stiff rubber inside the stirrup to cushion things a bit.

I'm surprised that you don't have a welder, building as much as you do.  Can pick up a used arc welder for next to nothing.   I bought my gas rig and tanks for $150 back in the late 80s.

Some of your pictures are not loading for me.  The first ones opened up, but the later ones didn't.  Technically, I'm being paid to work, so I can't focus on the forums as much as some other guys.  Sorry!

Best Luck!

[tooseevee]

Yeah, I was reading.   Lots of words.  And I looked at the pictures, which all seem to show the barrel of the knuckle well above the stirrup, which is well above the frame, and none of them showed it down where it would end up if you cut off the stirrup.  Seems like somebody could just drill a cross hole in the stirrup and call THAT drill hole in a couple sheet metal thicknesses the mount, or drill bigger, and weld in a piece of tube, or even swage both ends of a tube so it couldn't slip out the sides of a drilled hole in the stirrup, and be finished.

Or, there was the cheap and crude method the previous owner of my bike used.  I rode it that way for a while, but I improved matters by shoving a couple of pieces of stiff rubber inside the stirrup to cushion things a bit.

I'm surprised that you don't have a welder, building as much as you do.  Can pick up a used arc welder for next to nothing.   I bought my gas rig and tanks for $150 back in the late 80s.

Some of your pictures are not loading for me.  The first ones opened up, but the later ones didn't.  Technically, I'm being paid to work, so I can't focus on the forums as much as some other guys.  Sorry!

Best Luck!

        Oh, what a tangled web we weave.....

         The pictures you are looking at (in my very first post and in Reply #6 on Sept. 14) and telling me how f*cked up I am are the BEFORE pictures. That's the way the seat was mounted beFORE which is why I'm doing this; To LOWER the front of the seat and get my feel flatter on the frigging ground.

      The way you suggest is way more trouble than what I'm doing which is actually very simple. You'd see why if you were here. The configuration of the "horseshoe" and the seat bracket do not play well together. I HAD to be cut off.

       I had a stick welder for many years. I was never really an expert with it and it's crude. I had more of a circle years ago and people to work with. I gave the welder away along with a lot of harley stuff, tools, parts, etc.. when I gave my last harley to my last best old best friend because of pain that I've been riding with and dealing with my whole life. In fact I sold the harley before this one in 1998 for the same reason and immediately started gathering parts to build another one. I could not give it up. It's made me a stubborn bastard.     

       Anyway. I'm not justifying or defending what I'm doing any more. The seat post has ended up exactly as I pictured it.