[AzCal Retred]

Nope - the 411 ain't dead. Yours is paid for. The actual upshot is that new 452 apparently isn't a pile of kak. IF a guy wants a NEW, SHINY trail(able)bike he can now get one on par with a DR400 for about $6K guesstimated vs $7K-ish. That's all in the NEW bike universe.

Cheap old SOB's like you & me would just get a $1500-$2500 or so used DR400 or XL400 if we had delusions of boyhood trail flogging grandeur. Otherwise we just lurk in the weeds with our fistful of accreted Social Security cash and wait for some young(ish) 411 riding turk to be smitten with the "latest 'n greatest, new & shiny LC452" syndrome, swoop in and strike before he wakes up.

[ddavidv]

So it's still not really happy on the highway. Therefore, nothing to make me upgrade from my 411.
Oh, it's certainly better in most ways than the bike I have. But I don't dislike the bike I have, so improving upon it doesn't really tug at me to trade up.
A fantastic bike that will no doubt bring many new riders into the brand, though.

[AzCal Retred]

" So it's still not really happy on the highway. "
I assume you got that from here? From a motojourno that is used to liter-plus sportbikes and porcine, ludicrously overpowered wallet-sapping adventure bikes? A competent 4 cylinder DOHC fuel-injected 100 BHP 600-class sportbike would need to be downshifted to do a quick pass unless you are already taching 9,000 RPM and just buzz it up to its 12,000 RPM redline for a brisk 1/4th mile.
" It will cruise at highway speeds without issue thanks to the new six-speed gearbox, but if you need to make a quick pass, a shift or two are usually in order to do it with authority. "
What does not really happy even mean? We are talking about the LC452, a modern 40 HP, 6-speed, near 400 pound bike that will run +95 easily. A 452cc  short stroke one-lung motor is inherently busier than a larger displacement engine. It's not a problem to the machine RPM-wise, but you will be rowing the shifter more than on a Goldwing or "KTM 1290 (160 HP, 600 pounds wet)". The venerable KLR650 doesn't even make 40 HP but nobody is saying it's not highway worthy. Nobody spends great amounts of time above a wind-blasting 75 on the highway except teenagers and "sport riders", it's just too expensive contributing to the local constabulary. A larger displacement machine will obviously seem less "hurried" at 75 MPH, but that's a subjective feeling not a mechanical limitation. Smaller engines will be buzzier than larger ones. As long as they aren't putting your hands or butt to sleep via vibration it's all good. Personal preference isn't mechanical limitation.

[ddavidv]

"highway worthy" is going to be defined by the individual. I wouldn't have called my KLR highway worthy. Highway capable? Maybe. Highway comfortable? No.

Engines have their 'happy place' in the rev range. My 411 on a highway is happiest at 60-65. It can do 70, but feels a bit frantic. 75, when achieved, feels abusive.

The 452 doesn't sound like it will be massively different in this regard. Depends on where it's happy place is, which at this point is purely speculative. I may be proven wrong, which is fine. But I think some folks believe this will have the highway manners of a V-Strom, which it won't.

The only category (IMO) where the 411 suffers is at Interstate speeds, something it isn't asked to do in many corners of the world. It can do them, but not with authority or a level of comfort that larger engines can provide. If the 452 isn't substantially better in this singular category, it offers little incentive for me to trade up. That is not to say it won't be a great bike or superior to the 411 variants. It just won't justify a new financial investment to a lot of current model riders.  I think this bike is more about conquest sales than being a must-have for current owners.

[him a layin]

"highway worthy" is going to be defined by the individual.

fair enough.

[Deathwish]

"highway worthy" is going to be defined by the individual. I wouldn't have called my KLR highway worthy. Highway capable? Maybe. Highway comfortable? No.

Engines have their 'happy place' in the rev range. My 411 on a highway is happiest at 60-65. It can do 70, but feels a bit frantic. 75, when achieved, feels abusive.

The 452 doesn't sound like it will be massively different in this regard. Depends on where it's happy place is, which at this point is purely speculative. I may be proven wrong, which is fine. But I think some folks believe this will have the highway manners of a V-Strom, which it won't.

The only category (IMO) where the 411 suffers is at Interstate speeds, something it isn't asked to do in many corners of the world. It can do them, but not with authority or a level of comfort that larger engines can provide. If the 452 isn't substantially better in this singular category, it offers little incentive for me to trade up. That is not to say it won't be a great bike or superior to the 411 variants. It just won't justify a new financial investment to a lot of current model riders.  I think this bike is more about conquest sales than being a must-have for current owners.

I wouldn't disregard the added benefit of having that 6th gear, which if geared properly should still allow plenty of grunt at slow speeds and a more relaxed feel at highway speeds. Perhaps feeling much like having the stock 15 tooth sprocket of the 411 at slow speeds while feeling like the 16 tooth at higher speeds? I imagine it will still be anemic on the highway, but an improvement over the 411.

[AzCal Retred]

Then there's the "40 BHP vs. 24 BHP" thing. The LC452 has the same 10 lb./hp the interceptor has. The upcoming 452 Scram version should really add to the sales floor confusion. An old 650 TR6R Tiger weighed in at about 400 pounds and was 42 HP thru a 4 speed gearbox. The venerable 450 "Black Bomber" Honda was about the same. 40 HP is highway worthy. More than that is personal preference & wallet size. A 6-speed WR gearbox is icing on the cake, just like it is for the 650 Interceptor.

[James.]

Being an Interceptor owner and having more bhp on that bike it has never bothered me having less on the Himalayan.The national speed limit is 70 mph in the UK.The Himalayan copes,fine.The interceptor can reach 100mph + ..I don't need it.As for the arguement I need the extra power for overtaking all I can say is you must be taking chances.

[AzCal Retred]

If this has normal forks it'd be the one I'd go for. Probably lighter than the adventure version, likely for less money too. This bike is going to give the 650 a run for its money.
Royal Enfield Scram 450 (Himalayan Based) Render In Multiple Colourways SATYA SINGH OCTOBER 30, 2023
Copyright (C) 'RUSH LANE' Read more at... https://www.rushlane.com/royal-enfield-scram-450-himalayan-based-render-in-multiple-colours-12454493.html .
In the slew of planned future products, Royal Enfield Scram 450 is one of the most attractive The cat is out of the bag and we all know that Royal Enfield Scram 450 is coming. We have been witnessing test mules of Scram 450 since May 2022. It was first spied testing alongside its ADV sibling Himalayan 450. These are likely to be sold alongside the current Himalayan and Scram 411. Rendering artist Pratyush Rout has penned down his version of Scram 450.

Copyright (C) 'RUSH LANE' Read more at... https://www.rushlane.com/royal-enfield-scram-450-himalayan-based-render-in-multiple-colours-12454493.html .



Royal Enfield SCRAM 452 Features, Colours, Launch & Price Update
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuQAREex4cU

[AzCal Retred]

RIDING THE ROYAL ENFIELD HIMALAYAN 450: THE WRAP
https://dirtbikemagazine.com/riding-the-royal-enfield-himalayan-450-the-wrap/
I spent the last two weeks in a very strange world riding a Royal Enfield Himalayan 450. This is a new motorcycle to the U.S. but certainly not a new company. Royal Enfield is legitimately the oldest continuously run motorcycle maker in the world. The British company started in 1901 and hasn’t missed a year of production since then. A factory was opened in India in 1955, and now that’s where all the models are made. They served the domestic market well, but for years Enfield has been thought of exclusively as a retro brand in the west. With the Himalayan 450, that will change. This is a modern motorcycle designed in the U.K. to serve the adventure market. The real attraction is the price. The base model sells for $5799; basically half the price of a KTM dual-sport.
To be fair, the Himalayan wasn’t developed from racing stock like KTM, Husky and Honda dual-sport bikes. It was conceived from the start as an adventure bike. It comes standard with a rear luggage rack, crash-bars, 4.5 gallons of fuel capacity and a frame-mount windscreen. All that stuff ups the weight to over 400 pounds.
As I mentioned, I rode the bike for a good two weeks in a different world–I was literally in the Himalayan mountains. I couldn’t attend the U.S. press launch of the bike in Park City, Utah last month and the people at Royal Enfield then asked if I would like to attend one of the company’s adventure tours. It was called the Moto Himalaya Mustang ride, which started in Kathmandu, Nepal and trekked to the ancient kingdom of Mustang, right on the border of Nepal, Tibet and China. I said yes. I’m not crazy.
For now, I’ll save the stories of that ride for later and focus on the bike. To be honest, I wasn’t expecting much. The Himalayan 411 that came before this model was basically a throwback to another time. It was cheap, air-cooled transportation but had little else going for it. The 450 has nothing in common with that bike. It has what they call the Sherpa motor, which is a DOHC six-speed with fuel-injection. It’s a little bulky compared to a premium-level 450, but otherwise is perfectly modern. It’s mated to a steel frame and Showa suspension. The brakes are Bybre, which is owned by Brembo. It has antilock brakes which have four user-defined modes. There’s a handlebar switch that allows you to select the amount of intervention at start-up.In terms of outright performance, the Sherpa motor is right in line with any other EPA-approved 450 in the U.S. It perhaps doesn’t have the low-end snap of a Honda CRF450RL, but is otherwise right in the hunt. Its fuel-injection system is downright amazing. Our ride went as low as 2600 feet and as high as 15,500 feet above sea level. It kept going and going. At those extreme altitudes, you lose power, but the bike always ran clean, was easy to start and never stalled or misbehaved in any way. Once we got down a little lower, we found it would crack 160 kph in the dirt. At least, that’s what the electronic multi function instrument up front said. That translates to over 100 mph.
The suspension is another big win. It’s soft, but then it should be soft. After spending hours, days and weeks in the saddle it turns out that the Himalayan is a super comfortable bike. I especially  appreciated the fact that you could raise the seat height. The bike’s weight is, of course, its biggest drawback. There’s no getting around the fact that it’s heavy. Think of a Kawasaki KLR650 and you get the idea. The Royal Enfield motor has more peak power than the Kawasaki, but less torque.
The big question that anyone has with bikes that are not manufactured in Europe or Japan revolves around reliability. Normally, we can’t say much about that. A magazine press bike rarely gets very much time. In this case, the Moto Himalaya Mustang ride had a sample of 17 Royal Enfield 450s, all ridden day after day. There were no mechanical issues. The bikes were crashed, certainly, but even so, there was never anything more serious than a bent lever or two.
I’ll have more on the Himalayan in the December issue of Dirt Bike. And stay tuned for a report on the ride itself. Man, do I have stories to tell!

[AzCal Retred]

Interesting 450/411 evaluation.

Royal Enfield Himalayan 450 long-term test update one
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/mcn-fleet/royal-enfield-himalayan-450/first-impressions-update-one/

Royal Enfield Himalayan 450 long-term review update two | Joseph heads off-road and enters a rally
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/mcn-fleet/royal-enfield-himalayan-450/update-two-off-road-testing/
Having covered almost 4000 miles up and down the country on the Royal Enfield Himalayan 450, I can confirm that it is actually a surprisingly good touring machine. It offers all-day comfort and sufficient power to cruise safely at motorway speeds.
However, to truly qualify as an adventure bike, I wanted to see if it could also handle some light off‑road action.
As an adrenaline junkie who typically gets his thrills from B‑road blasts and trackdays, I wondered if I could experience the same wide‑eyed euphoria from tackling trails on the Himalayan 450.
.......
So, with a few quick modifications, the Himalayan can be transformed from effortless mile-muncher to a capable off-road machine, even for a novice. Its solid foundations make it a great tool for developing your off-road riding skills and embarking on true adventures.

Long-term Royal Enfield Himalayan 450 review update three | What do 411 owners think?https://www.motorcyclenews.com/mcn-fleet/royal-enfield-himalayan-450/update-three-too-clever-for-purists/
I recently rode the new Himalayan 450 to an owners club rally to get to the very heart of the Himmy adventure bike’s most diehard fans. I joined the rally to gauge opinions from Himalayan 411 owners on the new liquid-cooled model and to compare the two bikes back-to-back to see whether Royal Enfield have made the right changes.
At the rally, which took place near Shrewsbury, I heard an intriguing story about why these seasoned motorcyclists opted for a budget air-cooled single in the first place. Around the campfire that night, they recounted how, when the 411 launched in 2016, they attended the ABR festival and discovered that all the test ride bikes were booked up, except for one – the ‘ugly duckling’ 411.Open-minded and desperate to hit the trails, they took it for a spin. With each mile, the bike’s practicality became evident. It was manageable, cheap, and could handle anything. By the next week, they’d all got one. The air-cooled original may have charm, but it is still a budget motorcycle with soft suspension, unthreatening power, and a hefty weight close to 200kg. These were all aspects that the owners were keenly aware of and wanted improved for the next model. 
Royal Enfield listened and built a new version that was better in every conceivable way. When I arrived at the rally, I expected the owners to see the new bike and think ‘this is the answer’ and be tempted to trade in their 411s for the new 450. But I was wrong. People came and checked out the new machine all day, but it didn’t generate the enthusiasm I’d anticipated. 
Surprised by the reaction, I spent the next day riding the new model back-to-back with the original – and I was amazed by how different the bikes are. The air-cooled version feels surprisingly agricultural by comparison, and is never in a hurry to get anywhere, but its low weight and forgiving suspension do inspire confidence. 
The 450, on the other hand, feels far more serious with instant response and suspension that delivers far more composure and is vastly superior in my opinion. Even though the new bike is a far more premium option, I’m not convinced it really appeals to the same market as the original. All the 411 owners I spoke to thought the new 450 was almost too good, too accomplished and serious.

[AzCal Retred]

Video

CROSSING THE HIMALAYAS BY MOTORCYCLE
https://dirtbikemagazine.com/crossing-the-himalayas-by-motorcycle/
We sent Ron Lawson to the Himalayan mountains to get him out of our hair for a couple of weeks. He came back with stories and photos of the Moto Himalaya Mustang tour through Nepal where he rode the new Royal Enfield Himalayan 450 from Kathmandu to the forbidden kingdom of Mustang, right on the Chinese border. Here’s how it looked from behind the bars.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZEo3AHlx7E