Unofficial Royal Enfield Community Forum

Royal Enfield Motorcycles => Bullet with the UCE engine => Topic started by: reichel on July 29, 2013, 01:17:53 am

Title: Now Electrical!
Post by: reichel on July 29, 2013, 01:17:53 am
The other day I wrote in about my missing foot peg & appreciate all the reponses. New developement is I ran out if gas on the highway no reserve light anymore. Then left rear turn signal quit (bulbs OK) and indicator light soon after. I am coming to a crossroads with the Bullet. I've owned many bikes over the years 1969 Bennelli 125, 1969 Harley Sprint and about 12 other Harleys & Misc jap bikes. I have never experienced so many problems so quick on a bike that just hit 1000 miles. Thoughts?
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Arizoni on July 29, 2013, 02:19:51 am
Use your warranty to get it fixed?
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: D the D on July 29, 2013, 05:45:12 am
To quote my riding buddy: "There's nothing wrong with your Enfield a Honda dealer can't fix."
As in: He thinks my RE is a worthless pos junkbucket while I think of it as a hobby.  Really, burnt out lights, bad blinker relay?  My Mercedes does that and I could buy 10 new Enfields for what it cost.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: 2bikebill on July 29, 2013, 08:41:23 am
Check wiring and connectors, especially inside the headlight, but everywhere else too.
Royal Enfield ownership demands a certain, uh, philosophical attitude. The quality of the bike you get is purely a matter of chance. They aren't assembled by proud Japanese craftsmen, but lashed together by under-trained field workers just happy to be indoors and getting a wage.
You have to learn to love it, mend it, forgive it, enjoy the unique ride of it.
I do, but I don't trust it. If I'm going far, I take the Japper.... ;)
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: clubman on July 29, 2013, 09:17:31 am
The other day I wrote in about my missing foot peg & appreciate all the reponses. New developement is I ran out if gas on the highway no reserve light anymore. Then left rear turn signal quit (bulbs OK) and indicator light soon after. I am coming to a crossroads with the Bullet. I've owned many bikes over the years 1969 Bennelli 125, 1969 Harley Sprint and about 12 other Harleys & Misc jap bikes. I have never experienced so many problems so quick on a bike that just hit 1000 miles. Thoughts?

My reserve light blew a couple of months back too which I found out when I spluttered to a halt. In fairness, I've had the bike three and a half years and 12,000 miles - yours should have done a lot better. The electrics on this bike are just appalling, there is no other word. Why can every manufacturer other than Enfield in 2013 can produce a wiring loom that doesn't guarantee frayed wires and shorts on a regular basis? I long ago reduced my bike to 20 mile runs within a local radius and use a properly manufactured Moto Guzzi V7 for all longer rides. Yesterday I decided to put a bit more faith in the Enfield and do an 80 mile round trip. All went well until it died at traffic lights about five miles from home with another total electrical failure. Another blown fuse, a new one put in and got back with no further problem. I looked for frays or loose connections and couldn't see anything but then again with a mess like this bikes wiring I hardly know where to start. It's a pity when it is so enjoyable to ride when it runs and I thought Enfield might have improved in the last couple of years given the reputation that must be building up but it seems from your experience that nothing's changed. I guess they sell what they make without having to care about improving them but one day there will be real competition in the Indian market. Until then however...
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: reichel on July 29, 2013, 03:52:18 pm
Thanks for the replies. My bike is no longer under warranty. 2 years are up. The bulbs are good, it seems things are just failing. Love the bike but not being able to trust a 10 mile ride? It's a $7000. wall ornament!
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: D the D on July 29, 2013, 04:10:08 pm
She'll be good and reliable once you work through the bugs.  Some people just can't or don't want to and I understand that.
It's a shame the bikes come that way, but that's the price of having the classic old style bike.  I'd trust mine to go 100 miles now.  But not when I first got it.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Bulletman on July 29, 2013, 05:59:08 pm
For what it's worth....I got my 2011 C5 bullet in June of 2012..With 206 miles on it. I had the very scary and horrible wobble issue..which I have "kinda" solved with the help of this forum..( I just wish that RE would have attempted/tried to help me resolve the horrible and scary wobble issue. Specifically since they knew that a 19" front rim would have solved my problem...maybe they still might  ;)  it will shown good customer service on their part) but all the same I have Completely trusted my bike to pull through for me in all occasions...I now regularly do around 300 miles round trips in a 24 hour period and have no issues..she runs really smooth :)
I have had my share of Fuse blow outs and "wiring gone bad"  ;D.  But overall its minuscule compared to the enjoyment I get from riding my bike..
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: barenekd on July 29, 2013, 09:32:30 pm
It was 50 miles for me to get to my dealer, so short rides were never on my itinerary. In 16,000 miles, I had one fuse blow. I replaced the battery with an AGM early on simply because I don't like wet cells on motorcycles. The junker chain chain made it to 7,000 milrd with a lot of a adjustments. The Skidmasters made it to 2500 before dumping me on my butt. I thonk I put in the NGK plug at about 300 miles. That one lasted 15,000 miles before I changed it simply because I had more. I don't think I blew any bulbs, but I did replace most of them with LEDs so I could see them when the sun was shining. the only real problem I had with the Enfield parts was an underperforming headlight. It would get about a 1 volt drop from the battery to the headlight, so after several months of trying to find the cause, it had to have been in the switch box, I think, because the dimmer side had been replaced after the the bike was rear ended. At any rate I finally direct wired the headlight through relays and cured the problems. Anything else that failed was my doings attributable to aftermarket parts. I can't blame Enfield for that. And Jack and I did a lot of 250-350 mile rides in a day. We were never stranded.
Bare 
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gremlin on July 30, 2013, 05:06:17 am
...........I have never experienced so many problems so quick on a bike that just hit 1000 miles. Thoughts?

vibration is the gremlin in this machine.
the engine smooths out after about 1500 miles.
shift later than you think.
I don't know if the warranty is transferrable.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: reichel on August 17, 2013, 03:51:33 pm
I thought I would give an update to those interested. Took bike to a friends shop. Bob Eckna at Big Bottom Bikes in Oakdale, LI, NY. He fixed my wires and installed a Dynojet fuel injection module and put on an original bullet exhaust. I now have a bike that performs like a 500 and idles without stalling. As far as my future with this bike we will see. If it can't hold up to normal riding I will be looking for a 69 Harley Sprint 350ss like I had years back. Carry a condenser & points with you and no worries.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ice on August 17, 2013, 04:24:11 pm
Glad to hear the good news. 

Ride the crap out of it  ;)
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: AussieDave on August 17, 2013, 06:28:38 pm
sorry to hear about your bad exp. i had a couple of shorts from where the loom rubbed against the head and crank case. that was in the first 1500 k, now approaching 15000k and the bike has performed perfectly. i ride everywhere every day and head for the hills every week or so coz the motor feels better after 5 or6 hours running at hi speed\temp. blows out all carbon from the city riding i guess. id trust it to take me anywhere.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on August 17, 2013, 11:03:43 pm
Glad you're back riding.  Just curious, what Dynojet unit did he install?

Scott
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: reichel on September 02, 2013, 04:36:17 pm
Hello Scott, Sorry so long to reply. Bobby installed Dynojet Power 5 Commander #27-001 (PCV F/I,08-10,ROY,EFI Models). So far it idles well and has guts to it. A bit more tweaking to be done. Still finding wiring problems though.
Thanks.
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: D the D on September 02, 2013, 06:58:55 pm
reichel,
When you get it all sorted out, during bad weather you'll be so bored you'll go looking for another project to work on!
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gashousegorilla on September 02, 2013, 08:33:24 pm
Hello Scott, Sorry so long to reply. Bobby installed Dynojet Power 5 Commander #27-001 (PCV F/I,08-10,ROY,EFI Models). So far it idles well and has guts to it. A bit more tweaking to be done. Still finding wiring problems though.
Thanks.

   I have the PC-V as well, and am very happy with it ......... reichel, do you know if your installer used the base map that came installed on the PC-V , and just ran that?  Or did he use it as a base, and further tune it on the Dyno ?
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on September 03, 2013, 10:22:44 pm
So is this NOT the PC unit that was out earlier that people reported problems with?  As I recall, the early unit would occasionally report RPM spikes for no reason and throw things off accordingly.

Scott
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gashousegorilla on September 03, 2013, 11:13:14 pm
So is this NOT the PC unit that was out earlier that people reported problems with?  As I recall, the early unit would occasionally report RPM spikes for no reason and throw things off accordingly.

Scott

    ??? ??  Was there problems with an earlier version ?  Or was it how the map was set up, or how the bike was tuned ?  If the fuel corrections are set up  TOO lean for the bike and how it's set up, yeah the bike will buck and surge.  Especially if the corrections are made too lean, in the upper rpm's .   You can easily tell, just by looking at the fuel corrections on the computer screen as the bike is reved up. Negative numbers are fuel taken out from the stock ECU map, or a base map that may be used. Positive numbers are fuel added.

 The map that came with mine, which is for a stock bike with intake changes if I remember correctly? Was certainly not too lean for that configuration.   That base map was used on mine, but of course altered to match my bike.   I think there was an older version , where you could not raise the rev limiter ?..... But on the latest you can. Mine works fine....
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on September 03, 2013, 11:19:43 pm
The problem was reported by a few people with the Power Commander.  The PC would report huge rpm spikes, like 12k, that weren't really happening.  Of course when the PC saw one it threw more fuel at the engine so it didn't run right.  The problem was the PC, not the bike or the map.  There was a video of it somewhere.

Scott
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on September 03, 2013, 11:22:06 pm
http://www.enfieldmotorcycles.com/forum/index.php?topic=15154.0
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gashousegorilla on September 03, 2013, 11:49:22 pm
The problem was reported by a few people with the Power Commander.  The PC would report huge rpm spikes, like 12k, that weren't really happening.  Of course when the PC saw one it threw more fuel at the engine so it didn't run right.  The problem was the PC, not the bike or the map.  There was a video of it somewhere.

Scott

  Video's not working....  But yeah, you will get rpm spikes or what appears to be high spikes on the computer screen......if your too lean. It happened to me... nothing wrong with it.  I was just too lean. It's just erratically hitting the limiter and running like crap, because the fuel isn't set up right for the bike ..... Un-tuned is all. When I was done with the engine modifications we did and ran the bike , I saw some spiking.. . But once the bike is tuned, your fine.  The fuel ,and perhaps ignition, has to be corrected  for any particular bike and it's modifications.... like any other.  The PC-V isn't gonna throw fuel at it, or take fuel out by it's self. It's only going to correct fuel, according to what was programmed in the map, or as the tuner .... tunes it on the Dyno.   There is an add on to the the PC-V, called an auto tune. That will adjust fuel to a target AFR.... but that target number is set by the user. 
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on September 04, 2013, 12:07:49 am
Yes, sorry, it was not throwing more fuel at it since that wasn't in the map.  It was just the apparent RPM spikes that the PCV was showing.  And yeah, I couldn't see the original video either.

Are you using the PC Auto Tuner, or have you used it on anything else?  If I'm going to get one of these down the line I may as well do the tuning myself.  The unit is about $250, I can't imagine a tuner is going to charge me any less to get it set up.

Scott
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gashousegorilla on September 04, 2013, 12:53:49 am
Yes, sorry, it was not throwing more fuel at it since that wasn't in the map.  It was just the apparent RPM spikes that the PCV was showing.  And yeah, I couldn't see the original video either.

Are you using the PC Auto Tuner, or have you used it on anything else?  If I'm going to get one of these down the line I may as well do the tuning myself.  The unit is about $250, I can't imagine a tuner is going to charge me any less to get it set up.

Scott

   If it's the same Video I remember ?  I do remember seeing A LOT of negative numbers.... But, I have no idea how the gentleman's had his bike set up, as far as intake, exhaust, and or engine mods.  Whether he was using the mildly tuned map that came with it, and it was lean for some reason? or fuel was corrected that way ?   Dunno....

  And no Scott. I'm not using the auto tuner. Locally here, the price of a full on tune, no matter how long it takes. and it don't take long.... is $260. And 60 bucks if you just want to pull it on the Dyno a few times, to see how you've done with any work you have done on it and etc.   IMHO..... Definitely better done on the Dyno !  But, that's not practical for some. No access to a Dyno, constantly making changes to their bikes, just want to play around with the AFR's and do it themselves ?  Then the Auto tune might be the way to go.  But you need a good base map to work off of, or it will take a while  and a lot of riding to get it right. And even then..... you would probably not get it as good as if done on a Dyno.   I would try one though..... But just quicker, easier and more accurate for me to do it on a Dyno....

 
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Ducati Scotty on September 04, 2013, 01:07:09 am
My idea on the auto-tune is that it may take a while but it will get done right eventually.  I don't know how good the tuners in town here are or what their attitude is like.  Will they laugh at my tiny little air cooled single and not feel it's worth their time?  Do they have the ability to build a map for an unfamiliar bike from scratch?  Many tuners mostly work from a map that's close to what they're after on a bike that has been tuned by every shop one hundred times over.

And I'm not sure I'm that serious about it anyway.  If I ever do get to it, it will probably be a few years down the road.  Too much other stuff going on in my life these days.

Scott
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: gashousegorilla on September 04, 2013, 01:34:19 am
  Yeah, I think it would be fun to try, definitely.  And a good tuner IS important. for sure.  And it's actually surprisingly very quick and easy for them to build a map.... There just reading the display, looking at what the tail pipe sniffer is telling them as far as AFR's, and using THEIR better auto tuner on their Dyno, which also gives them immediate info as to what those changes were, and what the result was.  Then they just tweak the numbers to suit. Very quick and very interesting to watch. .....  heck , you see dirt bikes and Quads in there now a days.  They'ed probably be happy to see something different for a change.... 
Title: Re: Now Electrical!
Post by: Craig McClure on September 04, 2013, 04:21:19 am
I bought my G5 deluxe used & after a bit of "sorting" it runs like a BIG loud Watch.  Stick with it & look carefully at everything, Ease tight or kinked wiring, Locktite All parts.