[Toni59]

Today I finally brought my Himalayan in for a 5000 km service. I am still very satisfied with her. At this service, the brake calipers are now also changed, since my also affected by the recall.

In addition, I told my dealer that after a few weeks of standstill, the battery is always empty and then it no longer starts. I suspected the Indian battery and therefore exchanged it for a Lipo battery. However, this is emptied in the same way...
To my surprise, he told me that this problem comes from the gear indicator sensor and can be fixed.
Euro 4 models are affected, Euro 5 models are not.

Does anyone know this problem and what is fixed in detail here?

Regards
Toni59

[GSS]

It is a design flaw and this is the solution.

https://accessories.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/46817?ref_page=Himalayan

[Toni59]

Thanks for that link.
Yes, this exactly describes what‘s happening…

But the question is still how the technical background looks like in detail.
Also Hitchcock says, that the discharge „is reduced greatly“ with this device but not avoided…

What I would like to know:

What is the reason for the parasitic draw?
(By the way I was not able to measure it with my multimeter)

When and why does it occur at all?

Is there a solution to avoid it completely?

I do not believe that my dealer purchases this part 

[oldphart]

It just annoys me that the factory released a bike with this sort of fault at all. Us long timers are sadly used to it.

[Toni59]

@oldphart:

That is true.
You don‘t need to ride through the Himalayan to find this problem…

Just put it in your garage and wait 3 weeks. 

[oldphart]

It is a design flaw and this is the solution.

https://accessories.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/46817?ref_page=Himalayan

I'm not sure that's the answer. As Toni59 commented, it's only talking about reducing the drain and I seem to remember there was a 'cure' that was a wee bit more complex.
Sorry, my bike predates this so I haven't faithfully followed the discussions.

[Toni59]

Lucky you…

[zefnerd]

Thanks for that link.
Yes, this exactly describes what‘s happening…

But the question is still how the technical background looks like in detail.
Also Hitchcock says, that the discharge „is reduced greatly“ with this device but not avoided…
 Since there is aways a small draw on bikes due to electronic clocks, ECU's, or alarms, not claiming to completely fix the issue would be smart since some items that cause draw might be customer additions and some just the nature of modern motorcycles with ECU's.

What I would like to know:

What is the reason for the parasitic draw?
(By the way I was not able to measure it with my multimeter)
Depending on which gear (or neutral) the motorcycle is in, you will see roughly a 7 milliamp draw.

When and why does it occur at all?
At some point, Royal Enfield moved from a 3 pin connection for the gear position sensor which was completely passive, to the same 3 pins plus a jumper for power which connects in between the R/R connector which is always online. There is a box on the power connector whose contents are not known but may be a power converter, say from 12V to 5V. No matter what, one of the small resistors for the gps is always allowing power to ground and depending upon which gear you are in the drain will change since each gear relates to a different voltage drop from the different gear resistor values.

Is there a solution to avoid it completely?
Powering the gear position sensor from a circuit which switches on and off with the ignition resolves this particular issue completely, the Hitchcock solution does this by moving the power jumper from the R/R location to the rear light I believe. With EFI bikes, there will always be a small amount of drain, but it should be 1 miliamp or less at which point the self discard rate might be more of an issue.

I do not believe that my dealer purchases this part 
Probably not, it would be interesting to find out Royal Enfield's official stance on the product. The newest Himalayan's don't have the issue, but also have a new wiring harness which provides a switched power connection to the gear position sensor. I suspect the cost of changing the wiring harness vs. the relatively small power draw is why it lingered as a small but annoying issue. They seem to keep addressing small issues each year which is kinda nice.

[Toni59]

Hi Zefnerd,

Thank‘s a lot for the details!

hat is the reason for the parasitic draw?
(By the way I was not able to measure it with my multimeter)
Depending on which gear (or neutral) the motorcycle is in, you will see roughly a 7 milliamp draw.

I already observed some different discharges but could not find the root cause. Normally, when my bike is resting in the garage I switch it into neutral. That seems to draw a comparable high current….
Could be that 1st or 2nd gear draws less…

I wonder why obviously some riders don‘t have the problem or better don‘t experience it - because of that technical background this problem is present at every bike.

The only thing that helps is ride it more often, and this could be the reason: Frequent riders won‘t recognize the discharge!

[Guldner]

 

Afternoon

Having read this topic and experienced battery discharge to the point that the bike gets put in the shed…the bike is put on charge….So, I wrote to RE support……

Hello

I own and ride a 2020 Euro 4 Himalayan, as you know all Euro 4 Himalayans suffer from a battery drain problem allegedly linked to the gear indicator sensor, to the point that Hitchcocks have developed a “fix” for the problem. Please see the link below.

https://accessories.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/46817?ref_page=Himalayan

Product Details
ADD ON LOOM TO REDUCE BATTERY DRAIN, HIMALAYAN

Owners often report a premature drain of their battery on the Himalayan model. If the bike is left sitting for an extended period of time, the battery can fail to start the engine.

After running various tests, we have identified the main parasitic draw on these bikes, and with our add on lead fitted, this draw is reduced greatly improving the length in time that the bike can sit without use.

Fitted in a matter of minutes, this simple add on lead is a must for any Himalayan owner.

Assembled in house at Hitchcocks and supplied with full fitting instructions.

Owing to my bike being under warranty and you knowing of the said problem, what are you going to do to alleviate the issue?

Have you developed a fix? As you going to tackle it via a recall? When can I expect my bike to be “fixed”?

Hope I hear from you soon

Regards


And their response;

Hello Mr G….

Thank you for your purchase and taking time to make contact ourselves.

Please can you arrange for your bike to be inspected at your usual Royal Enfield Dealership, Authorised Repairer or any others of your choice.


If they diagnose your bike as needing the Add on GPS lead to rectify you’re your battery drain, They will submit a warranty claim as normal.

Please take copies of your service invoices with you if you decide to use another dealership other than the one that you have been using for maintaining the service schedule, to enable a speedy successful claim.

A fix was communicated out to the Authorised network over 12 months ago in relation to the GPS Lead, I am very surprised that when you have been in for servicing that this has not been mentioned to you, if you let them that you have been experiencing battery issues.

A Recall would not be required for this concern as it does not present a safety issue, This is why a Technical bulletin was published and released to the Network.

Hopefully this answers your question and gives you direction what to do next to get your bike repaired.

Kind Regards,


I hope the above helps, how many of you have been notified when visiting/having a service at your Stealership?

Have fun

G😎

[Crabsapper]

In my experience, the factory have no idea how bad their distributors/dealers are.

[oldphart]

In my experience, the factory have no idea how bad their distributors/dealers are.

In my experience, RE don't give a shit. Did you know that if you report a dealer, RE just flick the email through to the dealer without doing anything about it themselves? When I had my warranty dispute, I had to get another dealer (interstate) involved who was willing to ring RE and fight it out with them.

[Toni59]

@Guldner:

Am I right that the bug fix RE mentioned in their answer („GPS Lead“) is a different one than my dealer told me („Gear Indicator Sensor“)?

It is amazing how many battery drain issues are around….

[axman88]

7 milliamps doesn't seem like much parasitic draw to me.  An alarm with a blinking LED light will likely be drawing 2 to 5 times this much.

Assuming your machine is equipped with a 8 Ah battery, which is at 100% charge, I calculate a 7 mA draw would take ( 4 A-h / .007 A) = 571 hours ~= 24 days to be drawn down to 50% charge.

I'd be monitoring my battery voltage, to see where it's at.  Give it a full charge, remove the charger, then wait 4 hours to see what voltage a full charge gives.  Depending on the age / construction of the battery, the voltage vs. percent charge varies, but generally, as a battery discharges voltage declines.
Also, capacity declines with age, use and abuse.  Discharging the battery sufficiently that it will not start the bike, is likely to damage the chemistry, lowering the capacity.  Lead acid batteries should be kept above 50% at all times, if possible.

You might have voltages like:
100%   12.8 Volts
80%     12.5
60%     12.2
40%     12.0
20%     11.7

You might be constantly running with a discharged battery.  Remember, these machines don't have field coils in the alternator, charging power is only determined by engine RPMs and power draw.  At idle, with the lights on, the battery may be discharging.

I find that, on my RE C5, normal commuter riding is insufficient to keep my battery charged.  I spend too much time idling at traffic lights, or riding at low speed in traffic, conditions under which the battery is not charging.  Every component in the machine's system checks out as in-spec., it's just that my riding profile doesn't include enough sustained high rpms, to maintain the battery charge.  Knowing this, I monitor battery voltage, and every few weeks I put the bike on a trickle charger to keep it in the 70% charge or better zone.

[zefnerd]

  The response from Royal Enfield Support actually lines up with a posting I saw last year in April. Here's the part number that I couldn't find then, but does return as a RE part now at one supplier.
RAC00679/A
https://www.bike-parts-royalenfield.com/royalenfield-motorcycle/assignment_spare_parts/RAC00679_A
 People looking through their dealers didn't find it then, perhaps it will have made it to your support zone by now.

And their response;

Hello Mr G….

Thank you for your purchase and taking time to make contact ourselves.

Please can you arrange for your bike to be inspected at your usual Royal Enfield Dealership, Authorised Repairer or any others of your choice.


If they diagnose your bike as needing the Add on GPS lead to rectify you’re your battery drain, They will submit a warranty claim as normal.

Please take copies of your service invoices with you if you decide to use another dealership other than the one that you have been using for maintaining the service schedule, to enable a speedy successful claim.

A fix was communicated out to the Authorised network over 12 months ago in relation to the GPS Lead, I am very surprised that when you have been in for servicing that this has not been mentioned to you, if you let them that you have been experiencing battery issues.

A Recall would not be required for this concern as it does not present a safety issue, This is why a Technical bulletin was published and released to the Network.

Hopefully this answers your question and gives you direction what to do next to get your bike repaired.

Kind Regards,


I hope the above helps, how many of you have been notified when visiting/having a service at your Stealership?

Have fun