[oldcolin]

Hi

I have now completed my first 175 miles of my running in period.  I was told by the dealership not to exceed 50mph and also to change gear sympathetically at what seemed to be a suitable non engine straining speed.  Dexter gave me some useful tips including giving it the occasional burst in 3rd etc to help bed the piston rings. 
My next question is that, I believe, there is a second phase of running in to about 1200 miles !!!.  How should this be undertaken,  i.e. can I now do 60mph, can I give it a bit more acceleration through the gears.  I have never had a new vehicle in my 54 years of driving/riding so have never run in a vehicle before.

Thanks
Colin

[Red Leader]

Hi Colin,
I'm on a Classic.

On page 53 in my Classic owner's manual is a table for the 1st 300 miles & the 1240 or so miles thereafter.
The max speed for each gear is indicated.

0- 300 miles max speed in 5th is 40mph.
300 - 1240 or so miles max speed in 5th is 50mph.

Recommended gear change speeds are on page 61 in my manual & are equal or less (in some gears) to the max recommendations on page 53.
 
My bike feels really nice at 50mph & I haven't got to 1240 miles yet

Enjoy your Meteor
RL

[Dexter]

Hi Colin,

If RE had given the Meteor a tachometer, instead of the occasionally used Tripper device, it would be much easier to monitor a proper break in period than trying to watch the speedometer for every gear change, in itself a rather unsafe practice, taking your eyes off the road far too much.

Once you reach the 300 mile mark and do the first oil/filter change, it is time to start opening that throttle up a bit more, varying the engine speed as you shift through the gears. Getting a "feel" for the sound of your engine as the revs climb is helpful when you don't have a tachometer.

The Owner's Manual says to keep the top speed (in 5th gear) to 50 mph from 300 up until the 1,200 mile mark. I had mine up to that briefly, on occasion, in top gear, before getting to 300 miles. No wide open throttle though. I believe RE's recommendation on the break in period is a bit too conservative, in both mileage and speeds. I will be using 1,000 miles as the full break in period.

Top speed of the Meteor is supposedly around 70 mph, so taking it up to 60 briefly (in 5th gear) after the first oil change should be fine. Just don't sustain it at that speed for any length of time. Varying the engine speed is most beneficial to break in, with the occasional burst of acceleration.

Rolling off the throttle completely for a few seconds, after a burst of speed, is good for the engine as well, as the sudden decrease of fuel mixture entering the combustion chamber creates a bit of a vacuum effect in the cylinder, which tends to draw oil up the cylinder walls for a bit of extra lubing while decelerating.

Hope that helps.

[oldcolin]

Thanks All.
It is going to be a long slow process for me.

I just ride short leisurely rides and in previous years have completed about 650 miles per year.

I had a reasonable ride planned, 120 miles, but no way can I complete that at 40/50 mph.  I will have frustrated car drivers hounding me for the whole journey as it is on fast A/B roads.  Max legal limit of 60mph roads.

I did look at the chart in the manual, but was amazed at how low they were.  To change at some of these speeds seems to strain the engine.

Oh well I will persevere with what it says, although as the dealer said to keep it below 50mph, I did take him literally and have had some good 50mph rides.  Although max distance at that speed was probably about one mile each time.

Colin

[oldcolin]

Hi

Having reviewed it from the manual then it is maybe not as bad as it seems.  First 300miles

 Gear                       KMPH                               MPH                          Realistic
1                             20                                    12.43                        As soon as possible
2                             30                                    18.6                          20
3                             45                                    27.96                        30
4                             60                                    37.28                        40
5                             70                                    43.5                          45/50

Next 900 miles

 Gear                       KMPH                                MPH                          Realistic
1                             25                                     15.5                          As soon as possible
2                             35                                     21.75                        20
3                             50                                     31.07                        30
4                             65                                     40.39                        40
5                             80                                     49.7                          50/55

No difference really.  I still think that occasional 55mph in 5th wouldn't be too bad.  Maybe even a short blip up to 60mph

Or am I totally talking out of my exhaust pipe.

Colin

[Dexter]

Hi

Having reviewed it from the manual then it is maybe not as bad as it seems.  First 300miles

 Gear                       KMPH                               MPH                          Realistic
1                             20                                    12.43                        As soon as possible
2                             30                                    18.6                          20
3                             45                                    27.96                        30
4                             60                                    37.28                        40
5                             70                                    43.5                          45/50

Next 900 miles

 Gear                       KMPH                                MPH                          Realistic
1                             25                                     15.5                          As soon as possible
2                             35                                     21.75                        20
3                             50                                     31.07                        30
4                             65                                     40.39                        40
5                             80                                     49.7                          50/55

No difference really.  I still think that occasional 55mph in 5th wouldn't be too bad.  Maybe even a short blip up to 60mph

Or am I totally talking out of my exhaust pipe.

Colin

I think you are overthinking this whole break in thing Colin. DON"T baby the engine, but DON'T run it up to max RPM either. The worst thing you can do is lug the engine, meaning changing gears way too soon so that the RPM's are very low as the engine tries to push you along. Get that first oil change done and then open 'er up more with each ride.

Consider these facts: Every combustion cycle in the engine requires 4 strokes up and down for the piston and 2 revolutions of the crankshaft. Each valve opens and closes (two movements) for every 4 strokes of the piston. When you consider an engine running at   .  .  .  say 4,000 RPM  . . .  those parts are all moving so fast that it isn't hard to imagine that a wearing in process doesn't need to be a long, slow, drawn out matter. That is 2,000 explosions of fuel in the combustion chamber every minute!

A well broken in engine will have seen a wide range of steady engine RPM's (below red line), with many moments of strong acceleration and deceleration added to the mix.

[Fubars]

I think you are overthinking this whole break in thing Colin. DON"T baby the engine, but DON'T run it up to max RPM either. The worst thing you can do is lug the engine, meaning changing gears way too soon so that the RPM's are very low as the engine tries to push you along. Get that first oil change done and then open 'er up more with each ride.

Consider these facts: Every combustion cycle in the engine requires 4 strokes up and down for the piston and 2 revolutions of the crankshaft. Each valve opens and closes (two movements) for every 4 strokes of the piston. When you consider an engine running at   .  .  .  say 4,000 RPM  . . .  those parts are all moving so fast that it isn't hard to imagine that a wearing in process doesn't need to be a long, slow, drawn out matter. That is 2,000 explosions of fuel in the combustion chamber every minute!

A well broken in engine will have seen a wide range of steady engine RPM's (below red line), with many moments of strong acceleration and deceleration added to the mix.

Agreed I've had mine since last September and only covered 260 miles, I mainly stick to winding B roads and vary the speed between 40-50 mph.  Speed limit on most A roads near me are 50mph so that's suits me.

Don't think the engine will explode if you go over the very conservative 45mph it won't !  I read somewhere maybe on here that a motorcycle mechanic told them that the breaking in procedure was more for the benefit for the rider to get used to the bike rather than the engines benefit.

[Dexter]

I read somewhere maybe on here that a motorcycle mechanic told them that the breaking in procedure was more for the benefit for the rider to get used to the bike rather than the engines benefit.

That is probably true, but the manufacturer also has to stipulate some limits for their own protection of their warranty system, which could potentially be overwhelmed if every new rider was allowed to just get on the new machine and run the crap out of it right from the get go.

[scooter85]

I bought mine 68 miles from home and had to ride on the interstate home, I have seen results of breaking in running normally or by following manual. There was no difference in wear. I have had several new cars and motorcycles and drove or road them like I was going to be using them. never had a problem.

[Fubars]

That is probably true, but the manufacturer also has to stipulate some limits for their own protection of their warranty system, which could potentially be overwhelmed if every new rider was allowed to just get on the new machine and run the crap out of it right from the get go.

Yes but a degree of common sense also helps, I doubt every new rider would want to thrash their pride and joy from day one.  Some might but the majority wouldn't.  It surprises me that motorcycles need to be run in these days and cars don't. I have a lease car every three years and the advice the dealers give me is to take it for a "good run" to loosen it up.

[Ferdi]

More than speeds, it is important not to exceed a certain number of engine speed. For this it would be useful to replace that useless navigator with a good engine  counter.

[Fubars]

More than speeds, it is important not to exceed a certain number of engine speed. For this it would be useful to replace that useless navigator with a good engine  counter.

That's true a couple of people on here have just done that, but for me I do find it useful for the clock.

[oldcolin]

Thanks All

Its nice to stir things up a bit,  it allows everyone to express their ideas and to challenge thinking and adds to my overall knowledge.

Thank you

Colin

[Red Leader]

Hi Colin,

Don't know if you saw it in the manual but on page 52 in mine there's a note (bullet point 5) not to ride the bike for more than one hour before letting it cool down a bit during the running in period.

I've stuck to that even though the engine hasn't been getting too hot due to it being freezing cold outside when I've been riding.

Agree the 40 limit for the 1st 300 miles is a bit of an ordeal.
50 mph is fast enough for me & it suits lots of roads where I live - to be honest, I have found it quite enjoyable pottering about - a very easy bike to ride compared to my other main ride (MG Griso) which now feels incredibly heavy & a bit of a beast, frankly!

Cheers & put some miles on that bike!!!!
RL

[YOUR NAME HERE]

From the perspective of a new rider in his late 50s on his first bike (meteor supernova): Picked it up in October and with winter storage, it’s been in use for about 4 months. As a new rider fresh from the MSF course, I’ve been working on basic skills and confidence, so that keeps the break-in period rides a bit mellow.

That said, it’s done about 1100 miles of mixed slow urban traffic, short blasts on highways, and long stretches of country lanes.

I’ve seen here comments about the engine “really opening up” after being well broken-in and honestly never understood that observation, as a new kid in this scene.

But at about 1000+ it completely made sense. It’s been fascinating to feel/hear the changes, like it’s gone through puberty or something. I loved the machine as new but it does seem to have a different voice now, with more smooth and predictable power.

Some of this is down to new-rider skills improvement of course, but the break-in process has been quite a thing to participate in.

For what it’s worth, started really noticing this blooming after 950 miles & seems better with every ride since.

[oldcolin]

Thanks Guys

Looking at the videos I have taken I am not too far away from what the book says.  And seem to be sticking fairly close to what is said.  The only failing is that I have been taking it to 50mph, which to be honest is what the dealer said that I must not exceed.  So I will blame him !!!

I will take the rest of the run in more leisurely.  I shall  have to try and find slower routes where I can be happy that I am not causing too much of a tailback.  Its a thing that I hate doing.

Happy riding
Colin

[Red Leader]

RTD,
Yeah, my Meteor felt great when I sold it - I put a few miles on it but not too many after running it in.
The engine really freed up whilst I had it & it runs great- I'm in touch with the guy I sold the Meteor to; a great little bike!

I've only done 800 or so miles on the Classic- I think the gearbox on the Meteor was smoother than this one....could be down to the heel/toe shifter (which I loved!)- when I can I shall get one for my Classic. I have been looking on the internet but no joy as yet.....it'll happen!

Enjoy your bike
RL

[longstrokeclassic]

Page 52 *5 (Red Leader’s post) refers to to heat cycling the piston during the running-in process. Probably one of the more important aspects of running an air cooled engine in that’s oft overlooked by many.
Glad you’re all enjoying these bikes, I’m waiting for something along the lines of the Classic but with tubeless tyres to make an appearance from RE before jumping in on a purchase!

[oldcolin]

Hi

Fitted a Heath Robinson cheap tacho temporarily today just to get a rough idea of Meteor revs.

Bike has now completed 200 miles so is not yet first stage run in.
Here's what I found:

I was changing from 2-3 and 3-4 at between 3600 and 4000 revs

Revs in 5th:
40 mph        3000 revs
45 mph        3200 revs
50 mph        3600 revs

Probably not much use to anyone, but just a bit of fun.

I have my first service booked for 3rd May, so I can leisurely add the last 100miles over the next couple of weeks.

Colin

[johnakay]

do you really look at the rev counter on your bikes ever.
personally rev counter is nice to look at but that's it.
I know when the right time to change gear.
like it has been said DON'T labour or full throttle in other words wringing it neck.
where I'll be riding mine when I get it most of the roads are 50mph or less.
to many fury friends are about over the moors. to you folks sheep and kamikaze pheasants.

[oldcolin]

Hi

That's why I only fitted the tacho temporarily,  I have been used to having one on a bike but like you rarely use it.  Have only used it in the past to set idle.

I have like you changed gear when it felt right.  But it was nice to see what was happening, but once is enough.  I have checked some video from previous bikes and have realized how little I used the tacho.

Its a bit like my sadness when they got rid of the ammeter and oil pressure guide in a car, it was nice to have especially when there was an impending issue, but very rarely used.  Having said that they are both a godsend in my 1938 Morris 8 series 2.

Colin

[Keef Sparrow]

Its a bit like my sadness when they got rid of the ammeter and oil pressure guide in a car, it was nice to have especially when there was an impending issue, but very rarely used.  Having said that they are both a godsend in my 1938 Morris 8 series 2.

Likewise with my Jaguar XJ6 - those XK motors were legendary, but they were prone to oil pressure issues. 

[SilverbackRC]

Hi

Having reviewed it from the manual then it is maybe not as bad as it seems.  First 300miles

 Gear                       KMPH                               MPH                          Realistic
1                             20                                    12.43                        As soon as possible
2                             30                                    18.6                          20
3                             45                                    27.96                        30
4                             60                                    37.28                        40
5                             70                                    43.5                          45/50

Next 900 miles

 Gear                       KMPH                                MPH                          Realistic
1                             25                                     15.5                          As soon as possible
2                             35                                     21.75                        20
3                             50                                     31.07                        30
4                             65                                     40.39                        40
5                             80                                     49.7                          50/55

No difference really.  I still think that occasional 55mph in 5th wouldn't be too bad.  Maybe even a short blip up to 60mph

Or am I totally talking out of my exhaust pipe.

Colin

These modern engines really ought to be able to cope with it... I'd be surprised if they haven't put these figures in there for those out there that only have two throttle positions.. 'Open' and 'closed'.... - Whilst I don't want to give bad advice, I'd be amazed if you caused any damage at all going over their figures slightly every now and then.....

[Mr helicop]

Running in the Meteor is is the same as with any engine, use all throttle settings, don't nurse it, short spurts flat out no problem, worse thing to do is 70mph for long periods or low revs for long periods, otherwise just ride as normal, I have now covered 1200 miles and she goes better every time. Modern engines are nowhere near as tight as they use to be.

[Dexter]

Modern engines are nowhere near as tight as they use to be.

On the contrary, modern engines are machined to much finer tolerances than they use to be because it makes them more fuel efficient, as mandated by governments around the world. It is also why all modern car engines now require the use of a full synthetic 0W-20 grade of oil, as it is slipperier and better able to quickly lubricate critical engine parts than dino oils can.

[oldcolin]

Hi All

I was chatting to a guy at the Super Sausage Cafe last week who said that, I think, one of the magazines had done a survey ay first service interval where they checked oil and parts wear etc. of various bikes.  He said Royal Enfield came out top for engine build quality. 

If anyone knows about this article and can tell me where to find it, I would like to read it.

Colin

[khepabaul]

Hi All

I was chatting to a guy at the Super Sausage Cafe last week who said that, I think, one of the magazines had done a survey ay first service interval where they checked oil and parts wear etc. of various bikes.  He said Royal Enfield came out top for engine build quality. 

If anyone knows about this article and can tell me where to find it, I would like to read it.

Colin

 Fortnine did a very similar set of tests for his video called “Which Moyorcycle Manufacturer is the Best?”

[khepabaul]

Running in the Meteor is is the same as with any engine, use all throttle settings, don't nurse it, short spurts flat out no problem, worse thing to do is 70mph for long periods or low revs for long periods, otherwise just ride as normal, I have now covered 1200 miles and she goes better every time. Modern engines are nowhere near as tight as they use to be.

I’m at 700 miles. Mine gets real vibrating between 50-60 and then something magical happens and gets smoother from 60-65. Anyone experience the same? Is that the counter balancer in action?

I would assume the affect would be gradual as I speed up instead of kicking in at 60

[Guzziguy]

There is no way that I claim to be an expert but I feel that the RE manual is too conservative . Listen to the engine, it says plenty.
Similarly, I find the oil stipulation very odd- 15/50 may be great in India but not in the U.K. in my opinion.

[michiel]

what is the argument against 15w-50 ?

[Dexter]

what is the argument against 15w-50 ?

I would ask the same question. The wide viscosity range gives better protection at both ends of the ambient temperature scale, especially important on an air cooled engine.

[Guzziguy]

15/50 is thicker than 10/40 so takes longer to get to all the nooks and crannies within the engine. As most engine wear occurs in the first few minutes of starting a cold engine I’d thought that a thinner oil would be better in a cool climate. All of my previous motorcycles (nearly all air cooled) had temperature related oil requirements.

[Dexter]

15/50 is thicker than 10/40 so takes longer to get to all the nooks and crannies within the engine. As most engine wear occurs in the first few minutes of starting a cold engine I’d thought that a thinner oil would be better in a cool climate. All of my previous motorcycles (nearly all air cooled) had temperature related oil requirements.

Well, if you plan to ride in temperatures below -10 F. (-23 C.) my hat is off to you and you had best go with a 10W weight. Watch out for ice!

[Guzziguy]

Your own chart suggests that 10/40 is capable of dealing with 100+Fahrenheit temperatures; we last saw those in the U.K. back in 1976.
The chilling effect of rain water on the engine should not be underestimated.
My main point still stands, one grade of oil regardless of location’s climate does seem odd to me especially when other manufacturers suggest different options.

[Dexter]

Your own chart suggests that 10/40 is capable of dealing with 100+Fahrenheit temperatures; we last saw those in the U.K. back in 1976.
The chilling effect of rain water on the engine should not be underestimated.
My main point still stands, one grade of oil regardless of location’s climate does seem odd to me especially when other manufacturers suggest different options.

Your argument was with 15W-50. The 15W-50 is also capable of dealing with extreme cold too. Did you miss that in the chart?

If that chart can't convince you, I suggest you take your argument up with the engineers who designed these specs for the bike then. 

P.S.

15W-50 is not ONE grade of oil, it is called a multi grade, designed to work well in a variety of ambient temperatures. If you think some rain is going to cool your piston, you are not very well informed about the processes and the heat involved inside the engine.

[Guzziguy]

 Rain may not cool the piston but it will certainly cool in the sump;the front wheel directs it there.
My point is 10/40 will give an engine a better margin of safety at low temperatures for a motorcycle ridden in a Northern European winter whilst not failing to perform at 100 degrees fahrenheit.
Personally, I prefer an oil which is superior at low ambient temperatures.

[AzCal Retred]

Whilst you folks were arguing obsolete oils, Castrol, Mobil-1, Redline, Amalie, Lucas, Maxima, et al are surging ahead with a 5W-50! Coverage from Point Barrow (summer, anyway... ) to Phoenix in August. Science marches on...

How to achieve a liquid cooled engine for free? As far as air-cooled machines, phase change guarantees you likely won't stray too far from 212F head & barrel surface temps if you are out tootling about in a Monsoon. The evaporation coupled with airflow likely will drive it a bit lower. Unless you are in Mumbai, blessed with a 90F rain temperature, there will likely be some sunk costs for raingear... 

[Dexter]

My point is 10/40 will give an engine a better margin of safety at low temperatures for a motorcycle ridden in a Northern European winter whilst not failing to perform at 100 degrees fahrenheit.
Personally, I prefer an oil which is superior at low ambient temperatures.

Well, you might as well go for a 0W-30 then to really get that sub zero protection and still be good over 100F. However, viscosity charts don't lie and have been pretty much standardized for decades. Seriously, do you actually ride in temperatures that far below freezing?

Another point you are probably totally overlooking is that RE is recommending a semi synthetic 15W-50. I use a full synthetic 15W-50 in the Meteor and have used full synthetic in all my engines, big and small, for over 25 years. Synthetic oils, by nature of their composition, are well known to have quicker superior lubricating qualities on start up because they are thinner than dino oils, given the same viscosity numbers. They don't thicken like dino when cold, nor do they thin out more at higher temperatures.

However, you appear to be a man whose mind is already made up, so you will use what you want. Over and out.

[Guzziguy]

Not quite over and out.
I have been neither confrontational nor rude. It remains a fact that the same oil cannot be the optimal lubrication for the same machine in all climate conditions; what is best in summer in Chennai would be a poor choice in an early spring ride in Norway.
The U.K. lies between the two situations and I , having owned 70 plus motorcycles since 1968 have made appropriate choices without any problems.

[michiel]

The motorbike manufacturer specifies that a 15W-50 semi-synthetic oil should be used for this engine. The temperature table of the multigrade oil states that this oil covers the climatic conditions prevailing in Europe.
 You write, quote: 
"and I, who have owned more than 70 motorbikes since 1968, have made the right choice without any problems."
What exactly qualifies you to make this statement. Without taking into account the 70 motorbikes I have ridden. That is not a sufficient technical statement.
Or are they just blindly following the data written on paper ?
Surely it could be that they have always put in the wrong oil and it has been tolerated by the engines.
Where is the proof ?

[oldcolin]

Hi

My dealer who is a well respected dealer for RE and BMW put in Silkolene Comp 4 15W-50 oil when he did my 300 mile service on my Meteor 350.

That's good enough for me and it complies with the warranty here in the UK.  I suppose we could open up a new thread all about what complies with warranty and what doesn't, buy I am not taking any chances as they will be doing any warranty work on the bike should it need it.

The trouble is we will never know what oil is best as every rider has there own riding style and run-in method and every bike are different.

I just tend to go with what the reputable dealer suggests.  I am sure his intention is not to wreck our bikes.  He certainly had a number of different oils as when I asked him what oil he had used, he mentioned that the recommendation for bikes is different between manufacturers and he has to stock a wide variation to comply.

[Guzziguy]

I took the trouble to contact one U.K. oil manufacturer and two local RE dealers. All three agreed that 10/40 semi synthetic oil wold be fine in the Meteor; one going so far as to say that it would probably be better in winter.

[oldcolin]

Good job I don't ride in winter then.

[Dexter]

I took the trouble to contact one U.K. oil manufacturer and two local RE dealers. All three agreed that 10/40 semi synthetic oil wold be fine in the Meteor; one going so far as to say that it would probably be better in winter.

"fine" and "probably" isn't a ringing endorsement that 10W-40 should be the only choice.

Since you couldn't leave this alone until you found someone who (somewhat) agreed with you, I will just add that I never said that you couldn't use a 10W-40 blend. My point was that the 15W-50 was just as protective in the winter temps that you would experience, as the 10W-40 is. Viscosity chart figures are the empirical proof of this, but you seem to have an aversion to real proofs, so I'm happy that you now feel justified in your choice.

However, what you lose with the 10W-40 is less ability within the oil to withstand higher extremes in temperatures, something to be considered especially in air cooled engines. All Harley air cooled V-twins require a 50 weight oil. You don't live in Mumbai though, so again, your 10W-40 will likely be just fine burbling around the wilds of the U.K.

You came here to argue that 15W-50 was not suitable for your bike in your climate, but you are in fact - wrong. End of story.