Unofficial Royal Enfield Community Forum
General Discussion => Campfire Talk => Topic started by: Norm on November 05, 2013, 03:13:14 am
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Coming soon to a dealer near you. Liquid cooled and murdered out. But will it sell well?
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Huge wake up call for RE since these are apparently made in Haryana, India and US prices are reportedly 6,700 and 7,500 respectively. Hopefully we will see a RE twin, or maybe even the mythical Continental GT in the US one of these years 8).....competition is always good :D
http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-mo-autos-harley-davidson-street-500-street-750-20131101,0,443022.story#axzz2jju4VmYh
http://www.motoroids.com/news/harley-davidson-made-india-models-called-street-500-street-750/
http://blogs.wsj.com/speakeasy/2013/11/04/harley-davidson-unveils-new-smaller-bikes-for-urban-riders/
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What happened to Harley's proud "made in the USA" tradition? Or am I just pretending I remember it? I guess it's quietly gone the same way of Wal-Mart's similar campaign...
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So Harley went back to "Bitch Bikes", interesting. They spent so many of the last 20 years trying to build bigger and bigger engines/bikes, practically abominating the 883ci, and then they come out with a 750cc? ??? I'll be watching to see how this plays out sales wise. I suppose the 750 will suit some of those haggard ass women who ride Harleys to make them look prettier, but can't actually handle a 800 pound bike. ;D
Scottie
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What happened to Harley's proud "made in the USA" tradition? Or am I just pretending I remember it? I guess it's quietly gone the same way of Wal-Mart's similar campaign...
'Made in USA' tradition has been gradually eroding for the last several years, or should I say even decades. From cars, clothing, cameras, radios (this word does not even exist in the vocabulary of youngsters & teenagers :) ), speakers, computers, shoes ...............
Even the American legends Fords, HD have been 'assembled' in USA rather than fully 'Made in USA'. We have occasionally delved into this discussion before on the forum - what does it mean to be 'Made in USA'. HD has been using non-American-made parts for years.
Back to the topic, from the recent news it seems that these HD Street 750 will be also 'made' in USA for our local market to satisfy the need of its fans in North America. BUT will the parts be Made in India and then assembled here ? or Will all the parts be Made in USA ? That is the question. Goes back to same - what does the label really mean .... or is it just a slogan like a political statement.
These bikes with smaller displacements will be much appreciated by Indian riders many of whom are crazy for HDs.
http://profit.ndtv.com/news/corporates/article-now-harley-davidson-bikes-to-be-made-in-india-371354?pfrom=home-otherstories
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To me, it looks just like any one of the variety of Asian V-Twin "Harley clone" bikes that have been made in Japan for many years.
I guess that the pendulum is swinging back now, and Harley is making a clone of the Asian Harley-clones. They are out to capture the clone market with their Indian Harley clone!
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Why not add then to their American lineup and see what happens...From the pic, its looks good to me...The 500 cc supposedly has over 40 hp stock...Would think the gas mileage and displacement would satisfied the entry/younger market for them ...The price is on target and is right in the mix with Enfield...Yeah too bad it can't be made entirely in the US but most things are not anymore. May be a good move on their part and they will continue to manufacture their higher end products for the dark side riders...I'll probably take a look at one of these puppies next spring. just out of curiosity sake...GM
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Looks pretty nice to me...and you know how I feel about Hardleys. The footpegs are too far forward though!
Bare
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A video from HD on its design and creation -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msFh-lYAtBE
and its introduction at International Motorcycle Exhibition EICMA in Italy with a small clip of engine sound towards the end of video -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5BztHvbEnk
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Hopefully THIS will light a fire under someone to put a twin motor in the GT frame.
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I read a review of the two bikes on rideapart.com last night. Ref: http://rideapart.com/2013/11/2014-harley-davidson-street-750-and-500-2/
It mentions that the ones they plan to sell in the U.S. will be built in the U.S., not India, although it mentions that HD didn't say where the parts for the U.S. builds will come from.
I've never been a cruiser kind of guy, so they new ones don't appeal to me any more than any other bike of this type.
I always wondered why HD even tries to sell anything under the HD name that doesn't fit the traditional HD mold. We all know how well the VRod went down with "The Faithful".
Harley should just start a new, wholly-owned, but independent brand to expand their business. Then they wouldn't be stuck with any kind of expectations. Although I don't agree with how they treated Eric Buell, they couldn't go in this direction with his bikes as he was only interested in high performance bikes and made a miserable effort on that awful Blast model.
I think they'd expand their demographic greatly if they'd build a few "standards" that weren't yet another interpretation of the cruiser.
That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.
Cheers,
Dan K.
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Great move by Harley to take on the Asian competition in Asian markets. It will definitely attract a lot of younger folks in non-US markets and is squarely aimed at the mid-size market where RE hopes to be a major player. I bet there are plenty of folks in India who will be taking a closer look at the now more affordable and rideable HDs.
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I just thought of something.....
Why in the World is Harley releasing/producing a new version of their bikes in India?! Let me clarify. Harleys ride ride total dog shit on a brand new perfectly paved road. From what little knowledge I have of India, are not most of the roads there poorly maintained dirt roads? If this is the case, I foresee a massive epic fail within the 1st couple of years of the launch in India. Might do just fine here in the USA (as per the attraction of the younger crowd) but I see it doing quite poorly in countries that have mostly dirt roads.
Seriously! Anyone on this forum who has ever ridden a Harley at any point in your life, regardless of the year of the bike, could you possibly imagine trying to manhandle that bike down a poorly maintained dirt road? Sounds like suicide to me.
Scottie
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I just thought of something.....
Why in the World is Harley releasing/producing a new version of their bikes in India?! Let me clarify. Harleys ride ride total dog shit on a brand new perfectly paved road. From what little knowledge I have of India, are not most of the roads there poorly maintained dirt roads? If this is the case, I foresee a massive epic fail within the 1st couple of years of the launch in India. Might do just fine here in the USA (as per the attraction of the younger crowd) but I see it doing quite poorly in countries that have mostly dirt roads.
Seriously! Anyone on this forum who has ever ridden a Harley at any point in your life, regardless of the year of the bike, could you possibly imagine trying to manhandle that bike down a poorly maintained dirt road? Sounds like suicide to me.
Scottie
When was the last time you rode in India?
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I haven't myself. Just going off of what I've read and seen in videos and a close friend who works there 6 months out of the year. I apologize if I'm misinformed.
Scottie
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Regarding the roads: mostly paved and vary hugely in quality. Most unpaved roads you see in videos are up in the Himalayas. Many of those roads are rebuilt every year. You'll be riding on a brand new road for a fews hour then a dirt road then a shit paved one then a new one. Really, the roads are no better here in New York City.
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O.K, So it looks like Harley is copying the copies of it's own bikes? You can't make this stuff up!
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O.K, So it looks like Harley is copying the copies of it's own bikes? You can't make this stuff up!
+1
I like the look of the new Harleys. Maybe they will show up at the CW shows.
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Original Sportsters were racing scrambles and desert races a lot back in the 50s and 60s. they had a lot of power and weren't that bad handling. I almost bought one, but ended going with a Bultaco instead. It was about 250 pounds lighter!
I tried to push a Sportster out of my way with a 500 Triumph. I thought it was a 250 Sprint, but I was wrong. I was the one who fell off!
Bare
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The urban oriented 60 degree v twins are using suspension tuned for pot holes, according to HDs youtube video. That should cover marginal quality roads.
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Don't be surprise if they do well with these 2 new addition to their lineup.I'm sure their tea leave analysts predict a depressed/average economic recovery for the next few years . Couple that with affordability, less weight, better fuel mapping, low interest financing and the possibility of extending a new customer base in either country is worth the gamble... I could even see thousands being exported to quite a few developing countries that are coming into their own..The possibilities are endless if the product meets/exceeds expectations..
I would like to test ride one if they actually make their way here summer 2014..
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On the Yamaha forums people think the new bikes are to compete with the Bolt.
On the Honda forums they think they're to compete with the ST.
On the Harley forums people think they will be cow poop.
Really folks? A 500 and 750 to compete with a 950cc? Uh, isn't that the Sportster market HD has already dominated going on 70 years?
They announced them in India 2 months before they did in the US, so that shows the US is the target market?
Idjits! LOL It seems everyone has a perspective based on their brand loyalty regardless of reality.
At least people here know what market they're intended for. Overall, I find Enfield riders more knowledgeable and without the brand blinded arrogance of other brand riders. Well hey, most Enfield riders are other brand riders too! ;)
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Regarding the roads: mostly paved and vary hugely in quality. Most unpaved roads you see in videos are up in the Himalayas.
There are plenty of crappy paved roads (Mostly freeways) and dirt roads in SoCal. The HDs can get a workout here. I've ridden old Sportsters on dirt roads and they were a lot of fun. These new bikes are supposed to be lighter the old XLCHs, they are probably going to be a real Blast (pun intended).
Bare
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I was once told the H-D 883 was made for girls.
Really?? That's an insult to man or woman.
Now I ride a 500 cc single.
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I was once told the H-D 883 was made for girls.
Really?? That's an insult to man or woman.
Now I ride a 500 cc single.
Heh, I ride a 250 cc single. Does that make me a girly-man? ;)
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They should be making something like this, IMHO:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v457/guzzidoug/garage/SDC11741.jpg)
Cheers,
Dan K.
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is that the one I saw over on ADV?
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is that the one I saw over on ADV?
Yep, RTWDoug's "Dirtster". Fantastic story of the ride he took on it.
Cheers,
Dan K.
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That is one of the coolest H-D's I've ever seen! Sweet!
Any big ride plans for today Dan? ???
Scottie
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That is one of the coolest H-D's I've ever seen! Sweet!
Any big ride plans for today Dan? ???
Scottie
I've got to get the new tires onto the Ural today. I'll probably find time for a short ride this afternoon to scrub them in. Tomorrow is looking good for riding too. No plans for any destination. Did you get your head gaskets replaced yet?
Cheers,
Dan K.
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I've got to get the new tires onto the Ural today. I'll probably find time for a short ride this afternoon to scrub them in. Tomorrow is looking good for riding too. No plans for any destination. Did you get your head gaskets replaced yet?
Cheers,
Dan K.
Yep! Head gaskets replaced, 280 main jet installed (but I need to drop the needle a notch), new super bike bars installed. I'm good to go. :)
Scottie
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That is one of the coolest H-D's I've ever seen! Sweet!
Any big ride plans for today Dan? ???
Scottie
Hey Fellow Riders... it's free admission this week end to celebrate
Veterans Day!! I'm taking my visiting sister up to the
COLORADO NATIONAL MONUMENT
http://www.nps.gov/colm/parknews/newspaper.htm
for the day. This could be about the last good weekend to ride in Colorado
so go out and enjoy it.
that yard work will be there next week - Mike
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Yep! Head gaskets replaced, 280 main jet installed (but I need to drop the needle a notch), new super bike bars installed. I'm good to go. :)
Scottie
So we don't hijack the thread, look for a PM from me.
Cheers,
Dan K.
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So we don't hijack the thread, look for a PM from me.
Cheers,
Dan K.
Hey! Then we can't eavesdrop on you guys?
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Hey! Then we can't eavesdrop on you guys?
The Eagle flies at 1000 hours. ;D
Scottie
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Back to the original topic, here are two pictures from the show. The glossy tank is the 750 while the matt black tank is the 500. I think there are differences in the trim color on the motor.
To me, the new HD looks too "busy" with stuff packed into the frame, unlike the RE which is easier on the eyes. At 480# wet, it seems a bit heavy for a 500cc motorcycle. But I hear the 500 will be used in the "Rider's Edge" training programs. I guess that you could consider it proper product placement. ;D
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Now those shots kinda ruined it for me. Too long and low. It still looks like a Hardley. Bah, Humbug!
Bare
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I saw a shot yesterday of the new 750 kitted up in the cafe racer style. I must say it looked really nice. The accompanying text from the HD rep noted that it was (paraphrase) "just a indication of how an owner can make the bike his/her own by modifying the base model." Too bad HD wouldn't sell it off the floor in that guise.
Cheers,
Dan K.
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This will fill a need for entry level costed bikes for Harley. As a 20 something, I have said for a while, Harley will go under if they don't produce something my generation can afford off the bat. A new Iron 883 is 9500 or so out the door (After taxes and such) compared to 7500 tops for many a Honda or even a beautiful C5 military (my current dream). I just can't justify the cost of a Harley bike for what I plan on doing with it. I love that these bikes are built in the USA, but they're still Harley with all the connotation, baggage and lifestyle associated with it. I think I'll stick to bullet dreaming for now. They sound like more fun, anyway.