Author Topic: Tell me more, Oh Great One, about this new Ignition (Read 7731 times)

Joe28 · **on:** November 25, 2008, 07:03:29 pm

At first I didn't think I need it, but after the sprag went and from what I've been reading, perhaps I do?

What makes this one better?
What motors needs it?
(my Military has the new engine, was made June 18, 2008, (the date was written inside the primary0)).
How come it's free?
What symptom would a bike do to KNOW you needed one?
How do I get one?
Joe
So many questions, so little time!

UncleErnie · **Reply #1 on:** November 26, 2008, 01:33:08 am

I'm a day or 2 away from orderng a bike, and I was just about to ask that myself.

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #2 on:** November 26, 2008, 06:02:28 am

The factory has always passed along fixes for free if they think they will help. First the delay circuit, helped some, then the resistors, helped a lot, now the new ignition. If you order a bike, tell you dealer you want to make sure it has one. (This is new enough your dealer may not even know about it, but you faithfull forum watchers usually know things first). If you have an earlier model it is sort of up to you. Not all bikes have sprag issues. In fact most don't, but how do you know if you will or won't? There is no good way to predict this. It defies logic (other than those with loose bushings).
We are making it available free because it seems to be the best insurance against a sprag failure. Most of you won't need it, but if it were me I would put one in just to be sure. It is an easy half hour install, anyone can so it etc. In spite of us selling old technology bikes, Royal Enfield as a company really does care about it's customers. They have come up with this all on their own and are willing to provide them as a courtesy and as an act of goodwill. As a note, this does not apply to iron barrel bikes which have points ignition. If you want one call us.

Gromit42 · **Reply #3 on:** November 26, 2008, 06:54:36 am

So how does one go about getting one for free? my bike is an 06 with less that 1000 miles, and more than likely the sprag is what is toast, since the starter is just spinning but not engaging, and most times not even attempting to start. It worked for a while, then stopped. And I can't even kick start it. The plug is new, there is power from the battery, and measures out to what should be enough, but again, nothing happening.

thanks,
gromit and TD

Tiny Tim · **Reply #4 on:** November 26, 2008, 08:13:11 am

RE1,

For the benifit of us Electra owners who are not in the Colonies but still may be interested in the "New Ignition", can you supply details of what it is / does and how much we could buy one for please?

23hp · **Reply #5 on:** November 26, 2008, 08:37:15 am

Hi Tim

I have contacted my dealer in the UK who hadn´t heard of the Ignition with delay circuit but they are contacting the importer to see if the can obtain one for me.

Will let you know when/if the reply...

UncleErnie · **Reply #6 on:** November 26, 2008, 03:09:43 pm

By "new ignition", do you mean electronic ignition- or something else?
When I order my bike with a new ignition, is he going to know what I'm talking about?

REpozer · **Reply #7 on:** November 26, 2008, 09:01:13 pm

CMW, told me it is the TCI box, I haven't received mine yet, but the TCI is located under your seat.

Tiny Tim · **Reply #8 on:** November 26, 2008, 10:00:28 pm

Quote from: 23hp on November 26, 2008, 08:37:15 am

Hi Tim

I have contacted my dealer in the UK who hadn´t heard of the Ignition with delay circuit but they are contacting the importer to see if the can obtain one for me.

Will let you know when/if the reply...

Watsonian Squire, the UK importer will supply a delay module which holds of the spark for two and a bit seconds. This means that the engine should be "spun up" correctly and should help prevent sprag clutch destruction. It won't help if the engine stalls at super low revs and tries to go backwards as mine did.

This adapted TCI unit is a different fish altogether. I'd like to know what it does?

REpozer · **Reply #9 on:** November 26, 2008, 10:28:06 pm

TT, I may not have this all correct , The new TCI sounds like it is some how shielded from RF frequencies generated by your electric start motor. or it times out while you are starting. Apparently the RF noise could effect spark firing timing and possibly miss fire at the wrong time during E- start, thus slamming the sprag.
So yes, this new TCI will not save you from a loose or faulty sprag if it was a mechanicail problem.

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #10 on:** November 27, 2008, 05:18:58 am

95% of sprag failures are not due to worn sprags. The new ignition has a built in delay that works better than the delay circuit provided previously and also provides some electrical shielding

Adrian · **Reply #11 on:** November 27, 2008, 10:28:58 am

Kevin,

do you know if have they taken the opportunity to tweak the advance curve at all, or was the new box just intended to improve reliability? I'm still happily using a Suzuki TCI box on mine, but I'd like to know I'm not missing out on a performance upgrade!

Tim,

RE UK must have you on their Christmas card list by now, is there any chance of you scrounging one and road-testing it for us?

Regards,

Adrian

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #12 on:** November 27, 2008, 06:32:04 pm

I would guess with 99% certainty that the advance curves are the same. Tell me about the Suzuki unit.

Adrian · **Reply #13 on:** November 28, 2008, 08:48:19 am

Kevin,

I'm running a GS125 TCI box supplied by Rex Caunt Racing here in the UK. This was fitted during my quest to overcome the rev-limiter effect in 5th gear, which it turns out was caused by the stock Electra's over-gearing.

Never mind, it works well with the stock ignition trigger, though it's a larger TCI box than the RE item, plus I've had fun playing with the electrics!

The GS125 box is actually sold as part of a budget electronic ignition kit for classic racers.

http://www.rexcauntracing.com/pages/misc_products.html

Regards,

A.

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #14 on:** November 28, 2008, 09:58:01 pm

Thanks Adrian

jif1025 · **Reply #15 on:** December 05, 2008, 05:54:25 pm

Kevin, I missed it- how does one go about getting the fix? My ES hasn't worked since I bought my Electra (though kicks just fine!) and maybe this will help. From your earlier comments, it sounds like a good idea even if it doesn't remedy my particular problem! Thanks!

Josh

REpozer · **Reply #16 on:** December 05, 2008, 09:59:12 pm

Sorry I'm not Kev,
The free giveaway is for AVL lean-burn engines. CMW is giving a TCI (ignition box) that protects srag clutch failure during E-start.
If your E-start is not working now,the TCI box will not repair your current problem.

The TCI is located under the seat. It's about a 10-20 min job.

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #17 on:** December 07, 2008, 02:54:56 am

REpozer is correct on all counts.

Elk Grove Don · **Reply #18 on:** December 08, 2008, 06:47:35 pm

Just a word to the wise, have the serial # for your bike when you call for the TCI.
Don

jonapplegate · **Reply #19 on:** January 03, 2009, 02:28:52 am

Is this strictly for Lean Burn or can us iron barrel owners get one if we have Electronic ignition?

REpozer · **Reply #20 on:** January 03, 2009, 03:51:40 am

That would be for lean- burn. Iron barrel uses pints that are not prone to RF interference put out by the rotation of the E-start motor while turning. The RF waves do interfer with the electronic ignition box on the Learn- burn bikes. The new TCI box has a delay and is somewhat shielded from the RF.

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #21 on:** January 03, 2009, 06:15:57 am

As REpozer has pointed out the replacement box is only for the stock Lean-Burn engine. The best advice for Iron Barrel bikes is as follows.
1. Make sure the ignition is properly timed, never over advanced.
2. Make sure your battery is good
3. Never run it lean
4. Use the decompressor until the starter spins the engine up.

What you are trying to do is to limit or eliminate the possibility of a backfire.

Laurence · **Reply #22 on:** January 03, 2009, 01:57:24 pm

using the decompressr until the engine begins to turns over smartly - that sounds like good advice for the lean burn as well. Yes?

Joe28 · **Reply #23 on:** January 05, 2009, 02:43:49 pm

Using the compression sounds like a good idea. Now, if I can only remember to do that!

It took like 3 minutes to istall the new box! Beside being a different color, it's a LOT bigger than the factory? old? orginal? one.
I also richen up the mixture, and now when it fires, I reach down and turn up the idle to keep a nice "fast idle" til it warms up well.
I dunno if I'll have to do it when it gets warm, but, for now I am.
So far so good.
Stay Tuned.
Joe
I ride, therfore I am!

Tiny Tim · **Reply #24 on:** January 10, 2009, 08:30:03 pm

I have been persuing this matter with, at first Watsonian Squire, the UK importer and then, at their insistance, my local dealer (who is a sack of ****)

Phone calls started in November and I'm no further forward now that I was then.

Customer Service is a rare comodity in UK Enfield dealers / importers sometimes.

WATCH THIS SPACE

REgards

TT

REpozer · **Reply #25 on:** January 11, 2009, 01:25:33 am

Tim ,
Are you asking for a complimentary TCI or trying to purchase? I guess that would make a difference on your dealers responce.

PaulF · **Reply #26 on:** January 15, 2009, 01:55:47 pm

Quote from: Royal Enfield 1 on January 03, 2009, 06:15:57 am

As REpozer has pointed out the replacement box is only for the stock Lean-Burn engine. The best advice for Iron Barrel bikes is as follows.
1. Make sure the ignition is properly timed, never over advanced.
2. Make sure your battery is good
3. Never run it lean
4. Use the decompressor until the starter spins the engine up.

What you are trying to do is to limit or eliminate the possibility of a backfire.

Kevin, I requested the TCI updated box, but received two tiny resistors in an envelope.

What are others receiving??? I expected a plug & play replacement.

If there is a fee for the box, I'll pay it, but there's no way I'm attempting to update a circuit board in a motorcycle that's under warranty.

What gives?

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #27 on:** January 15, 2009, 03:55:57 pm

The resistors were an interim fix sent to dealers with each new bike. It is a pretty good fix, but not as good as the new box. Give Jane a call at 800-201-7472 be prepared with your VIN number so we can track your warranty registration and add your bike to the list of modified bikes. There is no charge we are doing that as a courtesy.

Tiny Tim · **Reply #28 on:** January 27, 2009, 03:00:13 pm

Repozer,

It was a complimentary (free) unit that I was trying to source.

The difference in the response on your side of the ocean is dramtically different to that received over here (UK)

The UK importers will not distribute the unit directly. They will only refer you to your supplying dealer. The dealer will then obtain it (f.o.c.) from the importer (eventually) and then expect you to pay him to install it as it is a warranty issue.

I just visited the dealer and when he showed me the unit, I took it from him and left the store!

He shouted behind me as I left "Um - I'll have to have the old one back mind"

After having waited two months and made numerous phone calls and umpteen excuses from the "I CAN'T BE BOTHERED TO DEAL WITH YOU handbook", I can't say I am impressed, when compared to our host's attitude to the same problem.

If I'm feeling generous, I may use vasaline or KY jelly when (if) I return the old one to him.

Only in the UK.....!

REgards

TT

Kevin Mahoney · **Reply #29 on:** January 27, 2009, 03:28:29 pm

In all fairness to Watsonian, in the US dealers are located much further apart geographically than in the UK. Industry standards would dictate that I only furnish these to dealers, but I would prefer that customers have new ones in whatever way is easiest for them as opposed having them without the new units becuase it was difficult to obtain.