[blasphemous]

Hi all,
I have converted to a RH shift and running gear oil. I have noticed that on first start (cold engine/gear box) after warm up when I first put it into 1'st gear, it is a hard change, meaning the bike shakes, like someone took a cudgel to it (a loud thud as it shifts into first gear). After that it is smooth shifting, even back into 1'st gear. Any ideas why this would be? Has idling anything to do with it?

Thanks and Please!

[Arizoni]

Sounds to me like the clutch plates are sticking together.

This is common with wet plate clutches after they've set overnight.  Especially when its cold.

Try this to see if it helps.

Before starting the engine, pull in the clutch lever and push the kick starter lever down.  It will be easy to push for the first couple of inches until the piston starts to compress the air in the cylinder.  Then it will get hard to push until the bond between the clutch plates releases and suddenly the kick starter will move all the way to the bottom of the stroke very easily. 
The clutch plates are now slipping like they should.

After doing this, release the clutch lever and proceed to start the engine as usual.

When you shift into 1st gear there will still be a bit of a clunk but that's the way it is with a transmission that uses dogs between the gears to transmit power.

[Stanley]

What oil is in the primary?
I use cheap ATF.

[Bilgemaster]

Yeah...if it only thunks when getting into gear after first starting, it's probably just sticky clutch plates. Before every cold start I usually hold in the clutch and kick it through a couple-few times just to loosen the plates up a bit. Also, what lube are you running in the primary? Do you have an electric start? (Whether or not you use it often or hardly at all). I use Type F ATF, about 800 ml, or just shy of a quart, with just a dash of Marvel Mystery Oil because I want to really bathe that flakey Starter Sprague Clutch doodad to keep it happy. If no electric start, then 420 ml, or up to the level hole is fine.

[blasphemous]

Thanks for the input guys.

a) I use ATF in my primary.
b) I kick the kicker over many times before start, but I use the de-compressor instead of the clutch. Should I have been using the clutch lever all along?  I do not have electric start.
c) "Then it will get hard to push until the bond between the clutch plates releases and suddenly the kick starter will move all the way to the bottom of the stroke very easily.
The clutch plates are now slipping like they should."  -- help me understand why the clutch plates come in to the picture in neutral. Is the clutch engaged even in neutral?

Thanks & Please!

[Stanley]

THe clutch is engaged unless the lever is pulled, no matter the gear.

[tooseevee]

Is the clutch engaged even in neutral?

Thanks & Please!

     Yes. Only the clutch lever disengages the plates.

[Seipgam]

As stated above, only operating the clutch lever will release the plates, either in gear or neutral.
If the plates are sticking a bit, with the engine running even when you operate the clutch in neutral, the gears will be turning somewhat and when you put it in gear it will clunk heavily.
Pulling the clutch and kicking it over a few times prior to starting will help release the sticking plates and therefore lessen the clunk into gear (it probably won't stop it all together).

Hope that clears it up for you.

Geoff.

[Bilgemaster]

Yeah, the clutch plates may kind of stick together after they sit and cool for a while...sort of like suction cups. Pulling in the clutch lever and kicking it over a few times before starting will help free 'em up a bit. You should feel them slipping free. It's just another quick step to add to your cold start routine, like putting on the choke.

Try it, and then as they say in the Haynes manuals, "observe effect on performance". I expect you'll be just fine, or at least greatly improved with far diminished "thunkage' in that initial first gear engagement.

If not, your clutch may need adjustment or maybe some fresh plates, 'cause they do wear out. Neither's a catastrophe, nor particularly expensive or hard to do. But my hunch is just giving them a little spin with the kick start before you fire it up will do the trick.

[blasphemous]

Thanks guys, that makes sense now. I also started to notice the issue at the end of FALL here in SLC-UT, wondering if cold has anything to do with it. Also I have never worked in the clutch area and only have a high level understanding of it as you all might already have guessed, if any of you can point me to literature or youtube videos explaining the clutch system as applied to a motorcycle I would much appreciate it.

[Seipgam]

Get you hands on a copy of Pete Snidal's manual on CD, It's pretty much the bible for these bikes and explains thing in layman's terms.  I'm new to Enfields and it has helped me no end (along with this forum).

Geoff.