Author Topic: How many oil lamps ? (Read 8394 times)

cyrusb · **on:** July 11, 2018, 01:31:54 am

I asked this question about ten years ago and received no answer. C.M.W was still selling them and would not say how many were in the country. It must have been a national security issue. But now many years after the last pre-unit bullet has been sold there must be an answer. So, come on Kevin, how many Oil Lamps? In leu of a real answer, lets take best guesses. I'll start with 1000.

mrunderhill1975a · **Reply #1 on:** July 11, 2018, 07:31:16 pm

I may have tried to answer this previously, but I will try again. Many years ago, maybe 2001, I found a Department of commerce website that listed the number of oil lamps imported from India, it was a table that listed the size of the oil lamp imported. It did not list the manufacturer, however, which company in India manufactures the big oil lamps? There is only one I believe. The big (500 size) oil lamp imports to USA from India in 2001 was something like 450 lamps. So, if we assume 450 lamps per year from 1999 through 2015, I get approximately 7,200 big oil lamps.
I have not been able to find that website from the department of commerce since 2001, but if we can find that website, we may be able to get a better estimate of the number of lamps.

cyrusb · **Reply #2 on:** July 12, 2018, 01:20:29 am

Holy cow, thats a lot more than I imagined. But wouldn't the years be 2001 to 2008. Isn't that when they discontinued the Oil Lamp Bullet in the USA ?

Bmadd34 · **Reply #3 on:** July 12, 2018, 04:40:37 am

Sorry, I wander in here from time to time from the UCE area :Prepares for hissing and booing:. What are "oil lamp" bullets?

Adrian II · **Reply #4 on:** July 12, 2018, 01:13:16 pm

Quote

:Prepares for hissing and booing:

Er... why would that be?

My Royal Enfields are a mix of Redditch and Indian C.I. and in some cases AVL parts. Where do **I** post?

A.

cyrusb · **Reply #5 on:** July 12, 2018, 01:19:09 pm

Oil Lamps = Pre unit bullets.

Adrian II · **Reply #6 on:** July 12, 2018, 01:25:39 pm

Quote from: cyrusb on July 12, 2018, 01:20:29 am

Holy cow, thats a lot more than I imagined. But wouldn't the years be 2001 to 2008. Isn't that when they discontinued the Oil Lamp Bullet in the USA ?

I seem to recall something posted by Kevin about the very last C.I. 500s being built in India for the US market in 2009. (The last imports into the UK were in 2007.)

A.

cyrusb · **Reply #7 on:** July 12, 2018, 03:08:51 pm

Still no guesses? I am revising my original 1000 to 500. That would average out to about 10 in each state. The dealer network just wasn't big enough to support big numbers.

mrunderhill1975a · **Reply #8 on:** July 12, 2018, 05:54:26 pm

Ok, if we are looking at 1999 to 2007 oil lamps, I am guessing a total of 3600 oil lamps imported into the USA,

Bilgemaster · **Reply #9 on:** July 12, 2018, 06:30:26 pm

Quote from: Bmadd34 on July 12, 2018, 04:40:37 am

Sorry, I wander in here from time to time from the UCE area :Prepares for hissing and booing:. What are "oil lamp" bullets?

Welcome! And no apology is ever necessary for your sophisticated modern well-bathed sort to wander in our primitive midst. You're certainly not gonna hear any jeering from me.

This is the first I'd heard the term too. i sort of figured from the context that "oil lamp" might be slang for pre-unit rides--maybe just the iron cylinder ones, maybe including the AVL ones too. A search of the Forum Archives seems to confirm this. Whence the term first arose, I know not, though "simple as an oil lamp" seems a likely harbinger.

Of course, staring as I am right now at my own "iron belly's" timing case, it does bear a vague, if rounded, resemblance to Aladdin's Lamp, if you squint at it just right, with all its associated Magic Carpet travel baggage...That or some big green Vulcan dildo. Who can say? Still, I don't expect "Spock Cock" is gonna catch on--too "modernist".

cyrusb · **Reply #10 on:** July 13, 2018, 02:15:50 am

Mrunderhill, 3600 is a generous guess. thats approx 450 a year. I live on an island of 3 million people, in ten years I have seen 1. Where are all theses things? But Who knows, keep the guesses coming. Bilgemaster, Romulan Codpiece is a Really good analogy, but Oil Lamp spoke to the power output and simplicity of a stock pre unit Indian Bullet. UCE engines when revealed in '05 were nicknamed "Stomach Pumps".

mrunderhill1975a · **Reply #11 on:** July 13, 2018, 06:37:04 pm

Cyrusb,
Perhaps 3600 is generous, however, I live in the middle of nowhere, 350 miles to a oil lamp dealer, and I have seen 7 oil lamps in a town of 20,000 people. That pencils out to 1 lamp per 2,857 people.

Assuming there are approximately 400,000,000 people in USA, that would mean there are 140,007 oil lamps imported into USA (hmm.........that seems excessive) I will stick to 3600 lamp estimate.
I am still looking for the Dept or Commerce data to get more accurate figures. If I find that data, I will post it.

hpwaco · **Reply #12 on:** July 13, 2018, 07:27:36 pm

So my 02 Bullet ES was one of those "oil lamps?"

Bilgemaster · **Reply #13 on:** July 14, 2018, 08:08:07 am

Quote from: hpwaco on July 13, 2018, 07:27:36 pm

So my 02 Bullet ES was one of those "oil lamps?"

That's right! Rub it, and a Genie will appear to grant you three wishes!

hpwaco · **Reply #14 on:** July 14, 2018, 04:04:02 pm

Three years worth of wishs came true when I sold it after 8+ k miles of awesome vibration.

Bilgemaster · **Reply #15 on:** July 14, 2018, 08:22:05 pm

Quote from: hpwaco on July 14, 2018, 04:04:02 pm

Three years worth of wishs came true when I sold it after 8+ k miles of awesome vibration.

Well, it takes all types to make a world of Enfields. I adore my '05 "Military" precisely for its awesome vibration, such as it is. I find it primitive and "elemental" in a way that soothes me...much unlike the only other 4-stroke single I've ever had, a BSA 441 Victor Special. That was just nerve-wracking at any speed over 45. Then again, I always sort of lug the Bullet along in its smoother "happy places", which seem to be about 50 to 53 and then again about 57 to 60 in top gear (if traffic makes this prudent) with my 5-speed box. In these speed ranges everything just seems to settle down and harmonize. Judging from my GPS and others' common practice on these Forums of always lobbing in a parenthetical "(indicated)" whenever a speed is mentioned, I must have the only accurate speedometer in Enfieldom. Mine's spot on, near as I can tell. I guess there had to be at least one.

cyrusb · **Reply #16 on:** July 16, 2018, 12:45:51 am

It helps if your (mostly stock) Oil Lamp isn't your only motorcycle. This way you can appreciate it in its comfort zone, and ride the "other' bike when you are in a hurry. This , of course is only after you change the fueling to a rich state. I also went to a 19 tooth tranny sprocket that gave it a great soul. Whats kinda funny is that the other bike can be practically anything!

blasphemous · **Reply #17 on:** July 17, 2018, 01:03:44 am

Quote from: cyrusb on July 16, 2018, 12:45:51 am

I also went to a 19 tooth tranny sprocket that gave it a great soul.

How so? Please help me understand? Whats the default?

cyrusb · **Reply #18 on:** July 17, 2018, 03:16:44 pm

Quote from: blasphemous on July 17, 2018, 01:03:44 am

How so? Please help me understand? Whats the default?

Changing the stock 17tooth for the 19 tooth tranny sprocket effectively raises the final drive ratio.So the benefit is a less frantic engine at 55. This may not be good for everyone. I easily get away with it because It has a solo seat and I weigh 130. Also Long Island where I live is a flat sandbar, so I can live with the reduced advantage that a larger sprocket gives. As an extra benefit, the two extra teeth eliminates the half link you must run with the stock sprockets. Soooo, if you are a full sized dude living in the mountains, keep the stock sprocket.

RE350 · **Reply #19 on:** July 18, 2018, 05:17:29 am

1000 sounds like a reasonable number if for every 10 bikes sold 1 was a 350 and 9 were 500s. In 2008 when a discussion was brought up on this forum regarding how many 350s were sold in USA Kevin mentioned about 100.

Arizoni · **Reply #20 on:** July 18, 2018, 07:33:08 pm

I'm surprised Kevin hasn't posted in this topic.

If anyone knows how many Iron Barrels (I don't like the name "oil lamps") were sold, he's the guy. After all, he is the person who imported all of them.

I mean, he wouldn't need to give exact numbers but a general guesstimate would be helpful and interesting.

mrunderhill1975a · **Reply #21 on:** July 18, 2018, 11:44:45 pm

I thought I found the answer at this site:
https://www.zauba.com/
But, the data only went back to 2012. I am still looking.

cyrusb · **Reply #22 on:** July 19, 2018, 12:20:38 am

1000 "pre units" sounds more realistic. And that would be from 1999 to 2008? That would be about 110 bikes a year. I bet these are close, if not on the money numbers. Arizoni, I agree, there ought to be a better name for the original Bullet. How about "Original"? Anyway, is Kevin Mahoney still on this site?

Ice · **Reply #23 on:** July 19, 2018, 05:00:11 am

More than 7,500.

cyrusb · **Reply #24 on:** July 19, 2018, 12:40:52 pm

Quote from: Ice on July 19, 2018, 05:00:11 am

More than 7,500.

Ice, is that a guess or a documented number? Even over 10 years thats huge.

Arizoni · **Reply #25 on:** July 20, 2018, 01:18:32 am

Quote from: cyrusb on July 19, 2018, 12:20:38 am

...
Arizoni, I agree, there ought to be a better name for the original Bullet. How about "Original"? Anyway, is Kevin Mahoney still on this site?

I hope so.
Kevin is the owner and the only moderator.

Bilgemaster · **Reply #26 on:** July 20, 2018, 02:00:11 am

Wouldn't it be nice if one could simply email or write to Royal Enfield and get an authoritative answer about this...or pretty much anything. I've written to the good folks in Chennai twice, first concerning my steering lock, and later about the fact that their own hosted Community Forums have been dead in the water since last year. No responses either time.

Ice · **Reply #27 on:** July 20, 2018, 04:55:17 am

Quote from: cyrusb on July 19, 2018, 12:40:52 pm

Ice, is that a guess or a documented number? Even over 10 years thats huge.

Educated guess. from 2002 to 2009 RE's western exports grew from 1,500 bikes per year to 5,000. "Half" were going to the U.K. and Europe while the other half were going to the US and Canada. At its peak CMW distributed to 125 dealers in the US. One in ten imported to the US may have been 350cc but let us not forget that the 350 was dropped early on due to lack of interest and poor sales. As far as I know none were 5 Speed. The 5 Speed was introduced in 2004 therefore we may infer that no 350's were imported after 2003 .

Stanley · **Reply #28 on:** July 21, 2018, 09:44:40 pm

I remember seeing ads in 1975 for olive green 350 Bullets in fliers for Rickey Racer, a trackside racing vendor. They sold me a pair of English racing boots for 19 bucks. I don't imagine they sold many RE bikes, but I recall the price was in the hundreds of dollars.

cyrusb · **Reply #29 on:** July 22, 2018, 06:30:53 pm

Stanley, I saw the very same ads in the late 70's. I think in Cycle Guide or similar. $1200 fob New Jersey sticks in my mind. A few years ago I spoke to a fellow who had bought some on speculation and according to him those bikes were rotting in the shipping crates. But those (350's)aren't the bikes I'm trying to count.