Author Topic: Hard Pannier Project  (Read 8267 times)

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addict1

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on: July 13, 2017, 12:56:12 pm
I'm in the process of designing/building an ali or fiberglass pannier set for my C5 (2013 Military). I'm not sure whether to go aluminium or fiberglass (molded) at this stage but the size will remain the same. Ali is cool but has its limitations but fiberglass (a bit heavier) can be produced en-masse at relatively low cost.

Catch is that I live apart from my bike  :-[ Can anyone with a bike handy supply me with the measurements for:
Air box to back of standard turn indicator/trafficator? (Basic length of pannier)
Widest point of the "rear fender support bars" (that bloody bulge which destroyed my soft bags)? (width of kit overall). MM would be preferred because, 2017 and all...

This will give me an idea of size (volume) for the design of the boxes.
I have a local boat builder/mate who will do the glass work for me so I might be able to do a run and send the "blanks" out if anyone may be keen.

I'm thinking that the frames are pretty straight forward, bend, weld, fit, bend, fit, weld, fit.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: December 14, 2017, 05:18:16 pm by addict1 »
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addict1

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Reply #1 on: July 14, 2017, 04:25:33 am
In case anyone was confused about the measurements I need, I have a photo attached...

Thanks!
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tracendaz

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Reply #2 on: July 14, 2017, 10:30:45 am
Hi Addict,

446mm from rear of airbox/fusebox to the forward point of the indicator.
375mm from the outside of one bend in the fender stay to the outside of the other.

In both cases just touching.

I have a 2015 UK C5 in battle green so your bike should be as similar as RE tolerances allow!

Good luck with the pannier project and please keep us all updated.

Tracendaz.
2015 Classic 500 Battle Green.


addict1

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Reply #3 on: July 14, 2017, 11:39:40 am
Great! Thanks Tracendaz! I will be knocking up a box mold for the glass trial soon; I'll post as I get along with it!
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mattsz

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Reply #4 on: July 14, 2017, 05:26:38 pm
...so your bike should be as similar as RE tolerances allow!

 ;D

Good luck with that!


heloego

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Reply #5 on: July 16, 2017, 12:37:59 pm
+1.
Looking forward to your results!  ;D
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Craig McClure

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Reply #6 on: July 16, 2017, 05:47:53 pm
I'm not a very tall person, last bike I used hard GIVI bags on was hard to mount unless on its center stand - which allowed me to climb aboard using the foot pegs. I have found that soft bags are smaller when empty & a easier for me to swing a leg over. You probably thought of that.
I always loved the pretty vintage British Craven fiberglass bags, but they wouldn't be a comfortable match for me.
Best Wishes, Craig McClure


addict1

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Reply #7 on: July 17, 2017, 04:44:31 am
 ;D I will be building in major tolerances (and hoping for the best) with the hard bags. I have a set of soft bags which have been faithful over 5000km but are worn through now. My main reason for going the hard bag route is for security; I found on my last trip that was reluctant to leave the bike to explore (museums, walks, shopping, etc.) I'm hoping that with a moderate level of security I can actually experience the places I visit.

As far as mounting the bike goes, 100% on the "center stand, step through method"; I have to do that anyway with my bag and tent etc. on the back rack.
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wildbill

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Reply #8 on: July 21, 2017, 01:58:54 am
that bike truly is - one great workhorse!


Rattlebattle

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Reply #9 on: July 21, 2017, 05:35:48 pm
Personally I'd always do an easy pannier measurement. I'll get me coat....
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addict1

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Reply #10 on: July 22, 2017, 06:44:48 am
@ Wildbill; I love her, I'm busy doing the trip report on that ride but it's taking longer than expected (as always).
So, with a bit of convincing from my overenthusiastic boat builder friend, I've decided to go the carbon fibre route. Picked up 12 squares super cheap on a UK site, www.easycomposites.co.uk. The process goes something like this:
Make a plug out of expanding foam and shape to pannier.
Cast a fibreglass mold off that.
Mold the carbon in the glass mold.
Easy; what could possibly go wrong!?
Foam block cast and started shaping the plug...
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addict1

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Reply #11 on: July 25, 2017, 11:39:02 am
Pannier plugs, Mk2; the mix and pour foam is too airy and a pia to shape freehand. I found some old fridge panels and stripped the foam out, shaped on a pattern and voila! Progress! Next the filler and fairing...
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addict1

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Reply #12 on: December 14, 2017, 04:51:39 am
So, my pannier project took a bit of down time but I recently made a come back and am almost ready to start laying up the CF...
1. One side laid up around plug and flange.
2. Lay up complete.
3. Ooops! The mold stuck in one corner and started to part! Had to split it plug and all; a little hacking and I got it all cleaned out!
4. Some trimming and polishing and I'm ready for the pannier lay up!

The CF will be painted to match the bike (as close as possible) and I'm thinking of going a bit old school with leather straps like old trunk luggage... But for now its epoxy and carbon...
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wildbill

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Reply #13 on: December 14, 2017, 10:32:55 pm
no-one else bothered to comment so good one ya for having a go! will be interesting to see how this pans out.
get into it! ;)


AmBraCol

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Reply #14 on: December 18, 2017, 07:55:08 pm
Looking forward to seeing how this finishes up!
Paul

2015 Royal Enfield Rumbler 500


addict1

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Reply #15 on: December 19, 2017, 03:43:57 am
Me too! I'm working slowly, trying to avoid all the pitfalls I've seen online; spent the weekend prepping the mould... 400 - 600 - 800 - 1000 - buffing compound. I really don't want it to stick!
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addict1

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Reply #16 on: February 05, 2018, 10:24:12 am
Pulled my first box out the mold! Came out pretty sweet for a first attempt; couple of dry spots here and there but easy to fix up.
Lots of learning for the next one...
BTW, box without lid weighs 1.1 kg (L410 X W210 X H300mm, roughly 25L)
I can't believe how strong this stuff is, stood on it with my 80Kg and it barely bows!
Now for some trimming and minor repairs...
« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 01:03:53 pm by addict1 »
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Bilgemaster

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Reply #17 on: February 05, 2018, 04:31:53 pm
You've got a rather nice texture going on there. Well done, Sir!
So badass my Enfield's actually illegal  in India. Yet it squeaks by here in Virginia.

 


heloego

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Reply #18 on: February 06, 2018, 03:29:58 am
Carbon Fiber?
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addict1

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Reply #19 on: February 06, 2018, 03:51:04 am
Yup, with a 1mm Corex material.
Thanks Bilgemaster! The weave pattern actually came out better than I thought it would, but I will be spraying them to match the bike (as close as possible, anyway.) Not sure if flashy CF patterns fit with the military bike; I'm thinking of going old school with some leather hinges and straps with buckles, with some form of locking clasp for security.
This project started as an idea for aluminium panniers, then fiber glass, then I found a great deal on CF and thought that would be fun...

Couple more pics with the opening trimmed out (roughly)....
« Last Edit: February 06, 2018, 04:17:49 am by addict1 »
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Bilgemaster

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Reply #20 on: February 08, 2018, 01:51:26 am
You gonna mount that electric toilet too, for that ultimate convenience on the road?
So badass my Enfield's actually illegal  in India. Yet it squeaks by here in Virginia.

 


addict1

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Reply #21 on: February 08, 2018, 03:48:43 am
Hahahaha... Yup, and the spare fuel tank in the background to extend my range!
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gizzo

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Reply #22 on: February 11, 2018, 10:37:40 pm
Nice job mate! That'll get the job done. You probably already know this and it's not a criticism of your work, just additional information so I'll throw it out there: If you want to save yourself a ton of time filling sanding and smoothing before painting the parts, consider painting in the mould. Prep the mould as usual with your wax, release agent, PVA or whatever you're using. Spray a few coats of hi build primer directly onto the mould. a light, dry first coat so it just covers the wax, then trowel it on. Doesn't even matter if it runs, they'll be on the inside. Lay up the part. A first layer of 3/4 oz cloth helps keep it nice, then the carbon. When you pop the mould open, the paint sticks to the part, not the mould and you have a ready primed, pinhole free part. Just needs a tidy up along the parting line, tidy up any voids you might have, scuff the primer with grey scotchbrite and you're ready to paint. You can do the colour on the mould too, if you feel like it.

If you can stand to leave the mould closed for a while, you'll find less print through, where the fabric pattern magically shows through the paint. If you pop the part as soon as the resin's set, you'll get more print through than if you leave the mould closed for a week.

You could use a bin liner as a bladder on the inside if you wanted. Stuff the right size bag in there, make up some kind of valve and inflate it, only needs a little bit of pressure. The bladder forces the cloth into the corners, helps eliminate voids and the bag won't stick to the epoxy.

Carbon vs fibreglass: Carbon is great but fibreglass is more flexible and easier to fix. If you drop the bike on the pannier and the carbon fails, it splinters into horrible shards and is a PITA to fix. Glass kind of tears up a bit more and it's easy to push back into shape and fix nicely.

My experience from building and fixing moulded and vac bagged boats and toy model aeroplanes.
All the best
s
« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 10:40:54 pm by gizzo »
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addict1

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Reply #23 on: February 12, 2018, 04:29:05 am
Thanks Gizzo! Man, would I like to sit with you with a few beers and a note pad!

It's been a fun project so far with a steep learning curve. Great advice on the paint (a la gel coat finish); I just laid up the second bag yesterday so I guess it'll be sanding for me! The bag idea would have been perfect, I looked at options to clamp the corners to keep them pressed in. I did allow the skin coat to cure a bit on this layup and kept pressing it in to the corners, so I'll see later today how it worked out.

Regarding the properties of the CF; I know it is pretty brittle under impact so I'll see how they do. I have the mold now, so worst case, I may just lay up a glass/CF hybrid at some stage.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 04:43:22 am by addict1 »
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suitcasejefferson

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Reply #24 on: February 16, 2018, 04:10:02 am
;D I will be building in major tolerances (and hoping for the best) with the hard bags. I have a set of soft bags which have been faithful over 5000km but are worn through now. My main reason for going the hard bag route is for security; I found on my last trip that was reluctant to leave the bike to explore (museums, walks, shopping, etc.) I'm hoping that with a moderate level of security I can actually experience the places I visit.

As far as mounting the bike goes, 100% on the "center stand, step through method"; I have to do that anyway with my bag and tent etc. on the back rack.

I love the look of that bike loaded down like that. It has "adventure" written all over it. Totally different thing from a modern BMW GS or KTM.

I won't get on any bike on the centerstand. I weigh 240 pounds, and I don't want to put all that weight plus the bikes weight on the centerstand. I also don't want to put that kind of weight on the footpegs. I always get on with the bike on the sidestand. When I first got the Enfield, I strapped a tailpack to the back portion of the seat (B5) I found it interfered with being able to get my leg over the seat. I didn't want to ruin the clean look with some kind of rack or throw over saddlebags, so I now use a backpack. I use the Enfield only for short trips anyway. Sometimes I ride it all day, but still stay within 100 miles of home. The Enfield is the kind of bike I ride to enjoy my interaction with the machine, rather than traveling. I have traveled more than 2000 miles from home on a Honda Rebel 250. It may be small, but it will run all day long at full throttle (actual speed between 75-80 mph) and it won't break down.

Best of luck with your pannier project.
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