[gremlin]

May I ask why you always use the kickstart?  Personally I always use the electric start, simply because it's quicker and easier.  I'm puzzled as to why you'd choose a slower and more difficult method!   

For the same reason he chose a slower and less-well-engineered motorbike.  It's all about FUN !

[Ice]

May I ask why you always use the kickstart?  Personally I always use the electric start, simply because it's quicker and easier.  I'm puzzled as to why you'd choose a slower and more difficult method!   

 Kick starting is less wear and tear on the battery and cranking system, extends their service life dramatically.

 

[malky]

If you ask a mountaineer why they climbed a mountain the answer is " because it was there"
Ask a motorcyclist why they fitted something to their bike, the truthfully answer would be " because it wasn't there"
I like the idea of a manual decompression, but a bar mounted actuator, for me, is a must. I'm working on it.

[Ice]

 IMHO the unit machines are begging for a bar mount operated de comp.

 Why else would there be a ready made place on the head for the de comp valve and that silly enrichener things cable connected to the already exiting de comp lever on the bar at the left switch control house ?

[malky]

IMHO the unit machines are begging for a bar mount operated de comp.

 Why else would there be a ready made place on the head for the de comp valve and that silly enrichener things cable connected to the already exiting de comp lever on the bar at the left switch control house ?

It has to be one of these.

[SteveThackery]

Just because you don't use it, doesn't mean someone else shouldn't  . If it makes you feel good, do it.

I didn't say they shouldn't.  I asked why.

[SteveThackery]

Kick starting is less wear and tear on the battery and cranking system, extends their service life dramatically.

If they are correctly specified, their service life should be as long as the service life of the rest of the bike.

I'm talking about the starter, of course, not the battery.  Are you saying the starter system isn't correctly specified or manufactured?

As for the battery, are you sure the battery's life is shortened by using the electric start?  Is that what ages a battery, or are there other ageing mechanisms that swamp any effects from using the starter?

If someone says "I use the kickstarter because I like using it" then I can totally buy into that.  If someone asserts that it greatly extends the service life of the starter and battery, alarm bells start ringing, the phrase "unsubstantiated assertion" comes to mind and I immediately have to ask "How do you know?".

[JVS]

  It is exactly because I like using it. That's how these bikes were used to be, no e-start. I'm just replicating those times. And because I like to keep my knee in shape for now, before arthritis 'kicks' in or something 

I also wanted a bar mounted actuator, just like the old decompressors. However, as I mentioned in my original post: That will require extra machining to guide the air towards the exhaust port. If your local bike workshop guy/girl can do it, then go for it. I barely got this one done by the workshop and really wasn't confident about the job after I saw what they did.

Maybe in the future I'll try to retro fit a spring mechanism on this decomp somehow and run a cable to the bar.

[Ice]

If they are correctly specified, their service life should be as long as the service life of the rest of the bike.

I'm talking about the starter, of course, not the battery.  Are you saying the starter system isn't correctly specified or manufactured?

 As for the battery, are you sure the battery's life is shortened by using the electric start?  Is that what ages a battery, or are there other ageing mechanisms that swamp any effects from using the starter?

If someone says "I use the kickstarter because I like using it" then I can totally buy into that.  If someone asserts that it greatly extends the service life of the starter and battery, alarm bells start ringing, the phrase "unsubstantiated assertion" comes to mind and I immediately have to ask "How do you know?".

 I say you're spot on about starters.  Let me add  in support the Prestolite starter of my (E/S only) Shovel Head. What differentiates it from other like starters in like bikes of similar usage is an annual tear down and servicing. 118,000 trouble free miles and counting.

  Your question on batteries is quite fair Steve. On that topic I offer empirical observation of my own and many other similar bikes under similar usage and similar maintenance among our group of friends and our acquaintances, over a span of forty plus years. 

 Damned internet and its lack of vocal inflection and facial expression. I'll risk being misconstrued anyway.

 In Harley E/S service we'd get an rough average of three good years from AGM batteries before the performance would begin to drop off while our K/S friends would get seven or more. In our liter bikes we would get a bit better for the same / same.  FWIW the AGM battery in my Bullet was dealer installed upon un crating.

 The consensus was and is that the higher loads and deeper discharge demanded of a battery from E/S coupled with less than optimal re charge cycle of the bikes charging system impose more electro chemical wear and tear on a battery than it would be subject to in K/S only service. The repetitive discharge/ charge or undercharge cycles tax a cumulative toll.


 
 

[SteveThackery]

The consensus was and is that the higher loads and deeper discharge demanded of a battery from E/S coupled with less than optimal re charge cycle of the bikes charging system impose more electro chemical wear and tear on a battery than it would be subject to in K/S only service. The repetitive discharge/ charge or undercharge cycles tax a cumulative toll.

Fair enough, and useful information.

There is another important factor to add to the mix.  One reason a battery will last longer on a k/s-only bike is because it doesn't need to be as healthy in order to start the bike.  It could have a high internal resistance and very small capacity and still start the bike, because it only has to power the ignition system. 

The battery on the e/s bike has to be able to provide a hundred amps or so, which is much more demanding.

My point is that even if the batteries degraded at exactly the same rate in the k/s and e/s bikes, it would come up short on the e/s bike sooner because of the greater demands upon it. 

Personally I've yet to be convinced that electric starting itself plays a significant part in wearing out the battery (unless the bike is a bad starter, of course), but I'm open-minded to this and happy to change my mind in the light of evidence.

Meanwhile, though, I wouldn't mind if I had to change the battery every three years if it meant I had the convenience of electric start.   

[gremlin]

Let's put this to bed.

IF you discharge a standard auto battery more than 20% each use (and the electric start does just that) you substantially shorten the battery life.

[Narada]

That graph refers to "low-solar antimony", which sounds a little too close to "ex-wife alimony to me!

My 2015 UCE E/S C5 starts in about one second.  I don't believe that discharges my battery 20 percent or prematurely wears out my starter motor.

That argument is UCE-less.

Manual decompression is fine for those with the older weak sprag, or those with "restless (kick-start) leg syndrome".

One day, I may add it for easier kick starting but so far I am preferring the E/S option.

That being said... nice work JVS. Impressive quality and excellent write-up.

[gremlin]

I agree the OP is a really good write-up on Decomp install in a UCE. 

have a look at the lower-most curve .....  That would be the lead-calcium generic auto battery chemistry.

I'm not saying E/S will kill your battery any faster than under-charging it and letting it sit for days on end.  I'm just giving the evidence requested by the questioner ......   

"Personally I've yet to be convinced that electric starting itself plays a significant part in wearing out the battery (unless the bike is a bad starter, of course), but I'm open-minded to this and happy to change my mind in the light of evidence."

[Ducati Scotty]

FWIW, the starter on the UCE Enfields is the same one used on some 800cc V-twin Suzuki cruisers.  I have one sitting on my shelf that I got some time ago. 

Scott

[SteveThackery]

Let's put this to bed.

IF you discharge a standard auto battery more than 20% each use (and the electric start does just that) you substantially shorten the battery life.

You're obviously having a joke.  Let's assume the starter draws 200 amps for three seconds (mine starts much faster than that).  That is 600 amp-seconds, which is 10 amp-minutes, which is 0.17 amp-hours, which is 1.4% of its capacity.

That's why I find it hard to believe it contributes anything much to ageing the battery.