[tooseevee]

Hi chaps could do with your help.
Got the bike back from the dyno motorcycle shop today.
The settings are :-
Pilot jet size 45 3/8 turn out.
needle jet P4
needle clip 2 ( in the lean direction )
slide 4
main jet 185.

            I won't comment on anything else because I would get myself in trouble (I'm not a dyno person or micro-tuner or speed tuner), but, I think, 45 is too big a Pilot Jet and 3/8 of a turn out on the Mixture Screw is not enough. The air is way too much squeezed off, methinks.

             I could be totally wrong, of course.

              Where is your Needle Clip? It's not clear to me. Are you one groove down from the top or one groove up from the bottom?

[tooseevee]

30 pilot.
If it won't run right on a 30 pilot, something is wrong. There are at least 50 Bullets that I personally know about using TM32 with 30 pilots, and they run right.
45 pilot is out in the weeds somewhere.

                Woops! Shoulda read this first before I posted. Sorry.   

[Dave1]

Tomorrow chaps, I'm going to let it idle see what colour the plug shows me. If it shows rich I will jet down, and if it shows lean I will jet up. I am also tempted to chuck the 30 pilot back in there.

Before I sent it to the dyno, I had the pilot at idle running sweet. That was with a 30 pilot fitted. But apparently according to the dyno, it was way to lean.

I have just looked at another Royal Enfield 500 dyno chart, fitted with a TM32, bullet whispers cams. etc. His af with the 30 pilot shows 17 at 1700rpm and drops to about 13.5 af at 2200 rpm.

Is it vital that the af be around 12-13.5 at idle to 1/8 throttle opening?

[Dave1]

Where does the AF start on the dyno chart runs you've done Ace? When you set a bike up? Do they start at 12:1 or 13.5:1 or higher?

tooseevee I think  it is one clip down from the top, leaning the mixture. One up from the middle, if that makes sense.

[ace.cafe]

I don't pay attention to A/F at tickover. I just adjust it to where I want it.  It is not critical,  but you don't want it to cough when opening the throttle.
At low rpms like 2000, I make sure that it doesn't cough when opening the throttle hard.

The rest is based on power. Typically it comes out around 13 with a fireball. I don't get particularly obsessed with A/F ratio as long as there are no big danger signs in the meat of the power curve.

[Dave1]

Thanks for responding Ace.

I am going to play around with the 30 and 32.5 pilot jet tomorrow. As I know with the 30 pilot fitted, it was running very well. If it runs very well on the 32.5 pilot, I might go with that option, I'd rather be rich that lean, but not at the expense of stumbling,stalling or fouling the plug.

[tooseevee]

tooseevee I think  it is one clip down from the top, leaning the mixture. One up from the middle, if that makes sense.

            Perfect sense. Only reason I ask is that I ended up in the middle with similar to you + the Ace modified head, but it's never been dynoed. It just runs good (AVL).

[Dave1]

Thanks for the information and replying.

When I get the pilot settings sorted again. I am going to just ride it for awhile. Just because I want to enjoy the bike. Of course I would like to fireball it or go some other route. Which there is quite a few in the UK actually.

There is Bullet Whisper, Andy Berry, Tollgate Classics, Hitchcocks.

All specialise in Royal Enfield Bullet tuning. Both Bullet Whisper and Andy Berry come highly recommended. Both race. All of the above mentioned have a different take on the crank set up.

[ace.cafe]

Thanks for the information and replying.

When I get the pilot settings sorted again. I am going to just ride it for awhile. Just because I want to enjoy the bike. Of course I would like to fireball it or go some other route. Which there is quite a few in the UK actually.

There is Bullet Whisper, Andy Berry, Tollgate Classics, Hitchcocks.

All specialise in Royal Enfield Bullet tuning. Both Bullet Whisper and Andy Berry come highly recommended. Both race. All of the above mentioned have a different take on the crank set up.

Bullet Whisperer has the fastest Bullet 500 in the UK except for Steve Linsdell's short stroke 500.

We assisted with our Ace roller rocker head mods. This resulted in higher power, and also 3rd Place in overall season points in the 2015 BHR Championship Series.
 

[Dave1]

I know Ace, I have been watching yours and Bullet Whispers collaboration with keen interest. Great results!

Andy Berry comes highly recommended as being a perfectionist and can do one off jobs being a machinist as well. Hes a really nice chap. Will literally speak for hours on the phone, never tiring. Very enthusiastic. It was Andy that prepared the Gordon May bike for Overland to India book.

Both Andy and Bullet Whisper are my favorite two picks in the UK. Having spoken  on the phone, with all the above mentioned in a previous post, to gage there knowledge, enthusiasm, and if they have a can do or can't do attitude.

Both Andy and Bullet Whisper can do anything anyone asks.

Not forgetting Henry at price parts motorcycle too. He does tune, but does not push it. But does get his own tuning parts to his design and spec made. Like his own cast 8.5:1 piston, and his R cams. Which improve the whole rev range apparently on a stock bike, all that needs to be changed is timing and carb settings. I haven't spoken to Henry yet, but I am going to. As he has a very reasonable crank at a decent price. Going to ask him about the spec of the crank.

I may still go the Fireball route mind. As I still think it is probably the best overall package out there. Its just a killer on shipping and import duty and vat.

[ace.cafe]

I know Ace, I have been watching yours and Bullet Whispers collaboration with keen interest. Great results!

Andy Berry comes highly recommended as being a perfectionist and can do one off jobs being a machinist as well. Hes a really nice chap. Will literally speak for hours on the phone, never tiring. Very enthusiastic. It was Andy that prepared the Gordon May bike for Overland to India book.

Both Andy and Bullet Whisper are my favorite two picks in the UK. Having spoken  on the phone, with all the above mentioned in a previous post, to gage there knowledge, enthusiasm, and if they have a can do or can't do attitude.

Both Andy and Bullet Whisper can do anything anyone asks.

Not forgetting Henry at price parts motorcycle too. He does tune, but does not push it. But does get his own tuning parts to his design and spec made. Like his own cast 8.5:1 piston, and his R cams. Which improve the whole rev range apparently on a stock bike, all that needs to be changed is timing and carb settings. I haven't spoken to Henry yet, but I am going to. As he has a very reasonable crank at a decent price. Going to ask him about the spec of the crank.

I may still go the Fireball route mind. As I still think it is probably the best overall package out there. Its just a killer on shipping and import duty and vat.

Yes, I have nothing against Andy, and I have heard good things about him.

I know Henry quite well, and he and I collaborated quite closely on the design of those R Cams. I think they are very good, and they do need that high compression piston to go with them, just like the Ace cams do, because of the late inlet valve closing timing.
 

I realize the issues about the shipping and taxation in the UK and other countries, and I face this quite often. I just cannot control those things.

[Dave1]

Well guys, I have just tried to tune in the 32.5 pilot jet with no success. Can't even get it to idle. It is still back firing through the exhaust. I have even seen an flame come out of the exhaust. Which from what I have read is a sure indicator that it is too rich.

If I go two turns out on the air screw the bike didn't want to start. If I went 1 1/4 below it ran better. I felt like I was getting somewhere. So I started to turn the throttle stop screw in, I got it to idle for a very short amount of time before cutting out. So I kept adjusting the throttle stop screw in, it did slightly improve, then I ran out of adjustment. Adjusting the throttle stop screw in, is of course leaning the mixture out, by letting in more air. So I am going to fit the 30 pilot, and try again, when the engine has cooled.

[Dave1]

I still am having the same problems with the 30 pilot..I am starting to give up on this damn bike Set the air screw out to 3/4, screwed the throttle stop screw out, thinking it needs to go out if it was all the way in with the 32.5. But nope still a flame coming out of my exhaust.

Which would say it is too rich. Just looking in my manual I am beginning to wonder if it is the carb..

In my manual under Complain : Flame at silencer ( after fire )
Defective spark plug
Too rich air fuel mixture
Retard ignition timing
Leaky exhaust valve

When I rode the bike back from dyno yesterday, it ran fine, until deceleration, with the throttle fully closed, then it would misfire through the exhaust and pop. Which again would suggest it is too rich..? Am I correct in this thinking? I So the timing should be ok right? I mean the rest of the time it was being ridden it was good? If the exhaust valve is leaking? Wouldn't it run like crap all the time?

I suppose it wouldn't harm to change the plug, just in case.
 

[Dave1]

Well the 27.5 didnt work out either. I have put the 45 back in, and now it atleast idles, but still spits through the exhaust. I sure as hell don't know what they did at the dyno place, because before i sent it in it was fine with a 30 pilot. If you screw in the pilot screw to far, that wouldn't damage the screw or screw seat when wound all the way in?

I am going to get the next couple of pilot jet sizes down, and one up. I will get this bike running the way it should.

The guys at the shop reckoned it had an air leak on the carb manifold. And sealed it with gasket sealant? This wouldn't course all the problems, i mean i tested it at home and had no problem before sending it to the dyno.

I am going to order some smaller jet down from the 45 and up.

[DanB]

Actually, it sure does sound like an air leak on the inlet manifold. Have you tested for leaks? Intake and exhaust?