[Vince]

     I've been a RE dealer since 1999. I'm one of their oldest. I've sold a couple of hundred units and serviced many more. I have never had this issue. To my knowledge not one of my customers has suffered this failure. I don't know what to make of this thread.
     Based on my experience in the industry since 1974, the RE rear brake system is as good as anything else out of England, and seems no more apt to fail than other systems. Every year I see 2 or 3 Japanese bikes with this failure when the rider removes the wheel, then does not properly reinstall the torque link.
     I know elliotthd believes the brake shoe failed, causing the other damage. I have only seen this sequence on very old bonded shoes, where corrosion caused the pad to separate from the shoe. If this is not the case, then my experience would suggest that this was a torque link failure.
     How to prevent this is probably as simple as proper set up and torque on the hardware.

[motomataya]

I agree Vince. I've seen is twice. Both times the nut was loose.

[TomJohnston]

Can an oversize (just slightly) bolt fit in the oversize slot to take up the play ?

[Sectorsteve]

Its happened to alot of riders. Especially those who clock up the miles.

[motomataya]

Tom, Its not just a bolt. The brake shoe pivot is part of it. It extends into the drum. When it twists it breaks the shoe at the pivot.

[tenacres650]

I had a 45 minute discussion with RE of America. NOT Kevin. They have assembled a group from HD, Triumph and other industry companies to build their brand in America. Huge amount of motorcycle experience. They see the design as sound. If properly (dealer) maintained not a problem. I know this, you can't torque the front (directly ahead of the axel nut) nut enough to prevent it from failing. With time the nut and washer slip into the swing arm groove and lock the rear end under braking. Some bikes make high pitched squeak before they lockup. Others do not. The darn things will kill you if you loose control or slid into traffic at speed. Emergency braking capacity? Sectorsteve may be right. Might not be the bike for you (or anybody). Eventually, an attorney will resolve it in a class action lawsuit. This is America. If one rider had the problem, oh well. But not this many.  This is not 1953. But the design is.

Once fixed it is gone and mean gone! RE was most accommodating to fix it under warranty. I appreciate that.  I wish them great success. But I don't trust the bike. The GT most likely has a different frame setup and should be OK.

Hi Professor, would you be able to share what they did to fix it from happening again please??
Do you have pics of any upgraded parts?

[singhg5]

I looked at some of the photos I had taken earlier.

At least on my G5, the cover plate anchor pin-bolt fits snuggly into the slot in the swing arm (photo 1). There is no up/down movement - though it can slide forward-backward along the slot, which is required to adjust chain tension.

The anchor pin-bolt, that acts as pivot point for brake shoes on the inside of cover plate also served as an anchor bolt on the outside of cover plate, as mentioned by Motomataya.

It has two nuts. The large one keeps it attached to cover plate (photo 2). Since it is behind the swing arm, it is not visible from the outside. This nut must be tight to prevent any wobble of the pin-bolt.

The second smaller nut keeps the cover plate from moving in swing arm slot and is of course visible on the outside, that has been mentioned above and discussed.

[Professor]

Swing arm, all new rear brake system (entire system), new chain guard, new rear brake rod, new chain adjusters, new chain. New rear tire and tube. I think they kept the rear wheel and brake drum, but that may change as it goes together. The last post I got from the dealer was "you get a new rear end and swing arm and complete service".  No pictures as it has been at the dealer for near two months. Frankly,  I did not ask what was replaced in detail. The warranty covers it all. Once done I will post the list.

Again let me say this. RE America was straight forward and fair. They stood behind the two year warranty. They could not have been more supportive. No jerks. Decent and fair minded people who resolved the problem. I've no complaint with them at all.  I think they mean to do business in America. And I welcome them.

On another but similar note. The Indian Stella scooters are the same. Run up to 6000 miles then start to decay and malfunction.  In know not RE, but the same industrial culture. I did long cross country on a Vespa 300ie.  The two Stella scooters with me went across, then began to die piece by piece. The RE works fine until you start getting above 6000 miles. The new UCE engine is NOT a problem (for the most part). It is the platform on which it sits. Plenty on this forum will say; "my bike has never had a problem". My response; "good for you, mine has and I have to live with it, not yours". I respect the fact that this is not uncommon. And RE said so. And then they fixed it. That matters a great deal.

[Arizoni]

For what it's worth, with all of this talk about the "oversize slot" I just went out and measured it on my 2011 G5.

The slot measured .480" (12.192 mm) wide.

The threaded stud diameter measured .467" (11.862 mm).

The Parts Manual says this thread is a M12 X 1.25mm size and my Metric thread spec says the size limits for an external thread this size is 11.760-11.972 so, the thread on my motorcycle is within its size limits.

Subtracting the minimum allowed stud size from the slot indicates there is 12.192-11.760 = 0.432 mm or.017" total clearance possible and in the case of my motorcycle there is 0.330 (.013") clearance.

Simply put, the amount of clearance in this assembly is typical of the clearance found in most mechanical assemblies.
Typically, there is .014" (0.356 mm) minimum clearance in a bolt to hole fit.
This includes commercial jet engines where the lives of hundreds hangs on the component design being safe.

For reasons beyond me (except it is almost impossible to get a torque wrench on this nut because of the rear brake rod), no torque value is shown in the Repair Manual for this  nut.

A bit of digging into my data says a torque value of 30-35 lb/ft would be safe for the nut and stud threads and this torque will provide a pinch on the trailing arm of over 3,800 pounds (1728 kg).

With that much pinch on the assembly, IMO there can be no movement of the brake backing plate under any braking conditions that I can think of.

[Professor]

tenacres650   They never promised it would not happen again. All they said, "is we will fix it. And then we suggest only a dealer maintain it".  I doubt the parts are any different than what I started with.

[tenacres650]

Thanks Professor, I was wondering if they might have upgraded any nuts bolts or washers, just to beef it up a bit. Sounds like its a maintenance thing, just like the rest of the bike.

[Sectorsteve]

Arizoni the clearance in swing arm slot on my 2 swing arms is 5mm. This gap increases over time/miles.

[Sectorsteve]

Mostly Enfield buyers riders , ride little kms/miles. Therefore most riders of enfields wont encounter these issues for some time.The only thing consistsnt with my c5 is that its had 1 issue or another from the beginning. It really is a novelty bike. Its been fun but not worth it for the 20k its cost me to own.

[Arizoni]

Your saying the slot in the swing arm is .197" (larger than 3/16") larger (top to bottom) than the thread on the stud?  It is 17mm (.670 inches) wide? 

Is that because the stud (and brake backing plate) rotated up and down and wore it oversize?
That's a hell of a lot of wear. 

As I said, with over 3800 pounds pinching jam nut on this inside of the trailing arm and the outer nut against the outside of the trailing arm I don't see how this is possible, unless the nut was never tightened .

[Ice]

Does this happen on 2015 C5's?  I have been a mechanic most of my life, but have no experience with motorcycles.  Would anyone be interested in giving a detailed description for the inexperienced as to how to approach this?  I could order some English brake shoes, that sounds like part of the answer, and make sure a "pivot bolt" stays tight?  Maybe I could use locktite and/or nylock nuts on that?  Something has to be all the way forward to check...?

I would like to address this invitation for death before it visits me.  I have a downloaded service manual from Nfieldgear and I think it is the best reference available, but does it show this?

Maybe Singh5 could make a video of this? It seems more important than anything else I've read concerning the maintenance of our bikes.  What exactly, should us new guys do to prevent this from ever happening?  I would prefer to permanently fix this so that there is no chance of it ever happening. 

Thanks, Ed.

 He did.   
 Link below.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASD9nFLSbmE