Author Topic: Who has a power comander  (Read 9311 times)

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Eagle56

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on: September 05, 2015, 10:40:48 am
just trying to get some honest views on the power comander and its ability or not to improve a mildly modified ECE

Do you think it's worth the cost or not


Farmer_John

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Reply #1 on: September 05, 2015, 11:45:34 am
Simple answer, yes.

Why?  By "mildly" modifying your engine, you've altered how stuff flows into, explodes, then flows out of it.

But you haven't altered how much fuel and air enter, take advantage of the altered flow, explode and then take the easier exit.

Even just adding a more efficient intake and exhaust exceed the parameters the mothership built into the bikes stock brain and then make it prohibitive to do anything to modify fuel/air and ignition to take advantage of these changes.

In the "old days", you'd pop the carb, grab a handful of different sized orifices (jets) and start swapping until you achieved making it run well.  If you were lucky, you gained engine performance.

Power Commanders do all that physical work.  We're fortunate that Dynojet provides a unit that is "mapped" (jetted) to our bikes in three steps.  Even adding one to a stock engine should improve fueling and ignition curves and result in better performance (think at minimum the curing of the off idle stumble/stall many experience).

The only thing to keep in mind, is that just plugging a unit in (and a couple of the plugs are a total biatch to get to) is not a 100% solution because of manufacturing inconsistencies.  But I'll guess it's good start.

Couple things that'll make it better.  Spend some time at a
Dynojet tuner shop on one of their dynamometers and with a seasoned tuner.  They can make accurate changes to your map to optimize the efficiency of your tune.  Again, modern jetting at work.

The other thing and probably more real wordly (and I have no experience with), but takes some time with, is Dynojet's Autotune box.  It's an add on to the PC that reads your bikes exhaust at the now unused o2 sensor and alters your map while you ride.  From my understanding, you can leave it on and in continuous use, so it constantly makes changes where it feels necessary or save your modified map to the PC and remove the extra box.

So yeah, I think it's worth it. 
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crock

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Reply #2 on: September 08, 2015, 04:57:17 pm
I can only speak about my own experience with two bikes. Adding a pcv to a 2012 added two bhp rear wheel hp from about 2500 rpm and up. Big change in throttle response. My 2014 with pcv and sports muffler has not been on the dyno. Power from 50 thru 70 mph in top gear is considerably better. Top speed is unchanged at 78 mph on the same stretch of freeway. Low speed throttle response is worse than stock but still good. Stock was perfect. Midrange and top end with pcv is perfect.Need to get my bike on the dyno. I averaged 62 mpg before pcv. Now average 53 mpg. There is a VERY significant drop in engine temperatures with pcv. I measured 35 degree drop on cylinder fins next to spark plug. Difference in engine temp is obvious just putting hand on fins.
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dickim

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Reply #3 on: September 09, 2015, 01:18:29 am
My 14 C5 has 1,400km (1,000m) on it with the last 200 being with K&N Filter, Free-Flow Silencer and Pwr Cmdr - it feels much better, less vibration (mainly due to mileage) and is more responsive.
Pulled the spark plug (GKN) yesterday after a 50k run and is perfect biscuit colour on electrodes but sooty on thread end ????. Yes a couple of plugs are hard to get at - but following advice on here to be careful when removing petrol tank, routing all before ANY connections, and it was no issue and fired straight up.
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Ice

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Reply #4 on: September 09, 2015, 09:27:49 pm
 This is all very interesting.

 On the lower end throttle response, who else experiences this and any ideas on a work around to rectify it ?
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Farmer_John

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Reply #5 on: September 10, 2015, 01:54:32 am
The only way to rectify it is by the two methods I mentioned.

Dyno tune it.

Install an auto tune.

In either case you have to change the parameters of fuel air ignition to make the engine behave (within its limitations) as you wish it to.

Thinking about it, my personal experience is my bike being stronger off the bottom and midrange and perceivably feels like it runs out of breath up top.

But I'm just now reaching 1000 miles and seems to be loosening up on every turn. 
"It's not what you know, it's how well you reference what you don't"

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Ice

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Reply #6 on: September 10, 2015, 04:28:51 am
Thank you Farmer_John. We are leaning ( no pun intended ) toward a pcv for the G5.
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Royal Stargazer

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Reply #7 on: September 12, 2015, 05:58:48 pm
I can also vouch for the PVC. I've got an aftermarket exhaust and air filter as well. The bike more accelerates more eagerly,  and seems to have more power at higher speeds (50 - 70), though still tops out at what the speedometer thinks is 80 - 85 mph.

Your fuel economy may take a hit (my riding style is rather spirited, which could explain my fuel economy) but the sheer enjoyment is worth it. Plus, the added tuning options as mentioned above. I'm considering an autotune unit.
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gizzo

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Reply #8 on: September 13, 2015, 12:04:23 am
PCV transformed the running of my bike from a leaned out PITA to something that's a total pleasure. I think it still could benefit from some tweaking but now it starts well, runs nicely and most important to me it doesn't stop running at traffic lights.
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2bikebill

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Reply #9 on: September 13, 2015, 03:21:35 pm
I've done around 2000 miles since fitting the PC-V plus Hitchcocks 535 performance kit - which, apart from piston & barrel, comprises performance valves & cams, K&N air filter, and I'm currently using a Dunstall type silencer (bit of a misnomer..). The bike (2010 G5) now goes like the clappers, much increased acceleration throughout, and 70mph feels like 60 used to. It pulls readily up to 80mph and sustains the speed without feeling like it's going to explode (80mph previously felt as though it was a real strain). I'm pretty sure there's at least another willing 10mph, but I'm dis-inclined to push my luck. I generally bang along at around 60mph, which is 3400rpm in 5th, but I really like having the extra grunt when a stretch of dual carriageway is unavoidable. I can actually overtake! Also cruises up long hills with ease, where before I'd be shifting down before the top. I've lost about 10mpg average, but 74mpg (UK Gallon) is still more than acceptable. Occasional misfire between 3000/4000 rpm, but doesn't happen at all some days. Hitchcocks say it's a glitch with the PC-V, affecting some bikes, and they haven't been able to iron it out. Tuning apparently just moves it rather than stops it completely.
2009 Royal Enfield Electra (G5)


singhg5

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Reply #10 on: September 14, 2015, 04:41:39 am
I've done around 2000 miles since fitting the PC-V plus Hitchcocks 535 performance kit - which, apart from piston & barrel, comprises performance valves & cams, K&N air filter, and I'm currently using a Dunstall type silencer (bit of a misnomer..).

The bike (2010 G5) now goes like the clappers, much increased acceleration throughout, and 70mph feels like 60 used to. It pulls readily up to 80mph and sustains the speed without feeling like it's going to explode (80mph previously felt as though it was a real strain).
I'm pretty sure there's at least another willing 10mph, but I'm dis-inclined to push my luck.

I generally bang along at around 60mph, which is 3400rpm in 5th, but I really like having the extra grunt when a stretch of dual carriageway is unavoidable. I can actually overtake! Also cruises up long hills with ease, where before I'd be shifting down before the top. I've lost about 10mpg average, but 74mpg (UK Gallon) is still more than acceptable. Occasional misfire between 3000/4000 rpm, but doesn't happen at all some days. Hitchcocks say it's a glitch with the PC-V, affecting some bikes, and they haven't been able to iron it out. Tuning apparently just moves it rather than stops it completely.

Glad to hear you now have a REal Bullet  :) !     Three questions.

Any change in vibrations at the handlebar or overall in the frame / seat / foot pegs ?

Is valve train noise still as loud / bad as before ?

Does it have the same hydraulic lifters and pushrods ?

How about a video with the new engine !
« Last Edit: September 14, 2015, 05:14:37 am by singhg5 »
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Eagle56

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Reply #11 on: September 14, 2015, 05:46:27 am
Mine can stop at lights and it has a stutter when closing down the throatle and opening it up again especially when having to slow and wanting to make good progress again

Not sure if the tick over is to slow causing this to happiness

Power is good if I did get one it would be to smooth it out and prevent the stutter.


2bikebill

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Reply #12 on: September 14, 2015, 09:05:12 am
Ha yes - it does finally feel like the bike it was meant to be - REal Bullet :)
No extra vibration, in spite of a noticeably bigger thump! Mine's never been much of a shaker and the extra capacity hasn't added any. There's always been a little more on the RH side, but both mirrors are usable at all speeds, and no discomfort through handlebars or footrests. I was surprised how smooth & stable it felt doing 80mph the other day for that few minutes in the outside lane  8) :o
Valve train noise (previously a big issue with my bike) is much reduced, but there is general non-specific machinery noise - plenty of wear & tear by now of course...
Same lifters, but new pushrods came with the cams. New springs & guides with the valves of course, and Hitchcocks re-cut the seats and did all the head re-assembly.
Overall a real improvement in performance, & loads of torque. I could wish the exhaust was a bit quieter, but that's the trade-off. The Dunstall does have a good deep thump though.. ;)
I'll post a video when I can.

Any progress with your repairs, Singh? The welding quality (and the rest...) is hit & miss with these early UCE bikes as we know.  Hopefully things have improved since the early batches...
« Last Edit: September 14, 2015, 09:12:09 am by WillW »
2009 Royal Enfield Electra (G5)


Eagle56

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Reply #13 on: September 14, 2015, 04:49:51 pm
What mileage are these comfortable in doing 12000 on mine will it take any extra performance


2bikebill

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Reply #14 on: September 14, 2015, 05:14:38 pm
No reason why a well maintained, well ridden RE shouldn't go on and on. Singh has 40,000 miles on his!
I did my upgrade at 15,670 miles. The extra performance is great, but I don't lose sight of the fact it's a single cylinder engine and not built for constant high rpm.

 
2009 Royal Enfield Electra (G5)


Ice

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Reply #15 on: September 14, 2015, 08:36:16 pm
Hello Will,

 That your W 650 is gone and your Bullet REmains speaks volumes to me about the mods you've done to your G5 and your satisfaction with the results.

 Any words of wisdom about the process for those who may choose to follow suite ?
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2bikebill

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Reply #16 on: September 14, 2015, 10:49:23 pm
Hey Ice. Don't know about words of wisdom... You may remember my bike had a crop of problems early on and I was pretty disenchanted with my "friday bike". But five years have passed since those problems were resolved, and on balance I seem to have a good bike! It starts on the button (original battery used for over 4 years),  runs smooth (it never was a shaker), handles like a dream and is a perfect fit.
I got rid of the W650 because somehow it just didn't fit me right. No matter what I did, it played hell with my arthritic shoulders. In all honesty, the Enfield was always my first love - I don't have to tell you there just isn't anything to match that Bullet ride. I just wanted it now to have a bit more grunt if it was going to be my only bike. I do kind of wish I'd tried it with just the valves & cams upgrade first, just to see how much difference they'd make on their own. But I doubt I'd have long resisted going all the way - and I did have the money from the W650 burning a hole in my pocket...
I'm very glad I did it, it's made it a much nippier bike and even more pleasurable to ride. Still those lovely long gears but with way more torque, and much happier keeping up with traffic on trunk roads. Quite honestly I still ride it the way I always did, spirited but nowhere near the red. I have Hagons on the rear and the proper amount of decent fork oil up front. AM26 tyres, and decent brake pads. It handles very nicely and usually out-corners the competition!
The engine upgrade itself is straightforward - the only tool I didn't have was a puller for the alternator.  The PC-V looked daunting, a lot of  wires, but clear instructions and no two connectors the same so no chance of mistakes.
Recommended. Go for it.  ;) 8)
« Last Edit: September 14, 2015, 10:53:56 pm by WillW »
2009 Royal Enfield Electra (G5)