[boggy]

Hey,
I've never had a chance to spend much time on dirt bikes.  Now I'm spending a lot of time on my DRZ which at it's core is a dirt bike, but mine is the supermoto version with street tires, brakes and suspension as well as a gearing change.  There are a ton of dirt roads that I cut through around here and I must admit I feel a bit like a deer on an ice pond when I'm riding on them.

I know these tires are not going to grip the dirt like dual-sport or moto-x tires would, but do you guys have some basic, dirt riding advice?  My gut tells me to lay off the front brake for fear of a front end wash out but I also slide like a mother if I'm solely on the rear pedal.  I'm not used to rear-wheel slide so my instincts aren't great.  The bike is a bit tall, and I don't feel like my foots doing much good anywhere except on the pegs.  These are just basic dirt roads.

I'll definitely get into some 705's or Disntanzias when I wear these suckers out, but for now I'm $tuck with them.  Scottie J, I know you like those Shinkos quite a bit.

Any advice?  Any ADV riders out there with road-bike experience on fire-roads?  Let me know.  Thanks.  Boggy

[High On Octane]

Dirt is a different ball game, and in a sense, you have to do everything backwards compared to on dirt.  The biggest thing to keep in mind, and to keep yourself upright, is body positioning in cornering.  On pavement when cornering, you want to keep your weight as close to the inside of the bike as possible, many times, leaning and shifting your body weight to the inside of the bike, this will cause you to slide out very quickly on dirt.  When riding on dirt, in the corners you want to keep your body weight on the TOP SIDE of the seat.  Meaning, if you are making a left turn, you want your ass on the top ride side of the saddle.  This keeps your body weight pushing DOWN on the rear wheel keeping traction.  You will also notice experienced guys sticking their inside leg out on sharp hard turns.  The key to this trick is to keep your inside foot as close to the front axle as possible.  This helps keep weight on the front wheel and helps prevent wash outs.  The last important key to riding dirt?  "When in doubt, throttle out."  If you are riding (usually at slower paces) turn or straight, if you feel your front wheel wanting to wash out, goose the throttle and push the front wheel forward again.  Hard to explain with words, but trust me, it works.   

Scottie J

[gizzo]

What Scottie said, + when you're sitting up on the high edge of the seat, put your weight on the outside footpeg. Helps to mash the back tyre into the ground and increase tyre grip.

[Vince]

     The front brake is for slowing down. The rear brake is mostly for controlling the suspension and rear wheel. Proper use in conjunction with the throttle can minimize wheel hop over whoops (repetitive bumps) or control front end height in jumps or wheelies.
     Throttle and brakes can be applied quickly, but they must also be applied progressively. That means no jerky or abrupt movements.
     There are some dirt bike courses offered by the MSF. I would take one. Don't wait until your tires wear out to replace them. Change them NOW and save them for when you sell the bike.
     In the mean time SLOW DOWN. What are you trying to prove? Dirt riding is fun! Tense and panicky is not fun. So slow down as you hone your skills. Watch some motocross or flat track.  Find a book and/or video to study. And find a riding buddy! Someone with more experience can help you through the learning curve and can help you when you fall. Riding in the dirt alone is insanely dangerous. A broken leg may mean no one will find you.
     I crashed about 10 yards off the course in a desert race. I was found only because someone else had a minor crash near enough to see my front wheel sticking up out of the hole I was in. One of my customers crashed in the woods. He was found three days later by a mushroom picker. Another day and he would have died. He spent 3 weeks in the hospital, mostly due to the delay in getting care.
     Dirt riding is a blast. I wouldn't trade my years of racing for anything. But as with any sport you have a serious learning curve. Do it smart and you will kick yourself for waiting so long to dirt ride.

[boggy]

"When in doubt, throttle out."  That, is a great motto... for many applications. 

Interesting about the weight distribution.  So, is standing better?  Or less critical on regular, dirt roads than it would be for say, single-track riding?

Vince, I'm travelling at such a slow rate that I'd be embarrassed if a car pulled up behind me.  "Tense and panicky" is exactly how I feel.  It's an odd feeling to go from being confident on pavement to feeling like it's my first time on two wheels when on the dirt.  The MSF course sounds like a good idea.  I think you are right about the tires too. 

OK cool - thanks guys.

[High On Octane]

I stand when on rough terrain, some people stand the whole time, I personally just remember to keep my body upright and my shoulders and elbows square.

Scottie J

[Vince]

     Standing up puts all your weight on the foot pegs. This effectively lowers your center of gravity, making the bike much more stable. Sitting puts your weight on the seat, making the bike more tippy.
     Generally you would stand for fast straight(ish) riding. Sit for corners, but slide forward to load the front wheel for better traction. Standing or sitting you would slide back to lighten the front end to go over bumps. Handling is better when bumps are mostly handled by the rear end.
     Using the brakes shortens front suspension travel as the act of braking causes the bike to dive. The diving front end twists out of your hand easier. Under power the front end lightens and the rear end rises. This gives you maximum suspension travel. Most bumps are more easily handled under power, not braking.
     Slow is relative. Go at your comfort speed. Let anyone in a hurry pass you. What do you care? Let them go. You have nothing to prove. How embarrassed  would you be if they had to pull you out of a ditch or call an ambulance for you?

[boggy]

Ok. Thanks and thanks, guys.

[barenekd]

K70s work quite well in the dirt. Do you still have the Skidmasters on your bike? They don't work well anywhere.
Bare

[boggy]

I have the K70's on my AVL, but it's still on the disabled list until I get some new clutch plates (and a California plate).  The day I put those K70s on back East, I did some dirt roads in horse-country and the Bullet felt really good and sturdy.  It was part of the reason why I switched form clubman bars to a moto-x set-up.  I wanted to do some scrambln'. 

Thought it was going to be a great way to explore out here... That is until I caught a case of supermoto-fever.  On the DRZ are the stock, Dunlop 208SM tires and they aren't very good off, or even on road.

[High On Octane]

I love the 705s!  I have not one single bad thing to say about them other they are a little slick in actual mud, clay mud anyways.  I believe they are labeled as a supermoto tire to be honest with you.  The same tires are on my foster bike, the '01 BMW F650GS, and I've had that bike over the Ton a few different times and they always felt very stable.  If I remember correctly they are rated up to 118mph.  You can get a full set with tubes and rim strips for about $150.  You can't beat them for how much performance they pack into such an affordable price.

Scottie J

[olhogrider]

Boggy, where is that? I like dirt roads and I'm kind of new to SoCal.

[boggy]

Looking at the map... I think it's Pankey Rd?  It's actually a road that leads to an RC air-field.  I'm basically exploring any dirt I see - some roads pan out some don't.  This is just the driveway for the air-field, but I wanted a pic there.

Bare has tipped me to some primo riding spots around Temecula/Fallbrook/Rainbow/Pala.  Killer, killer roads.  De Luz Cayon is simply amazing.  There's some dirt to be had there.  I've been up and down it a few times and it's a dream.  A bunch of stuff near the 76 + 15.  W.Lilac, Couser Canyon, Rice Canyon.

I'm in North County, near the coast so I just head into Fallbrook and the fun begins. 

[olhogrider]

Aha! I am in San Pedro. I've been up in the Rohr Flats area between Santa Clarita and Mojave with my Yamaha but the dirt roads are nothing the RE can't handle.

[barenekd]

You guys need to go over to Palomar and ride up the Nate Harrison Grade. It's the west road that goes up to Palomar. It's fairly steep, tight and kinda rough. Perfect for dirt bikes! It's not terrible, I made it on my Goose. I ran off the road into a little ditch and had to use the "When in doubt, throttle out" technique. I kinda pointed the bike at a little gap and nailed the throttle. It blasted right out of there! It is good advice, been using it for years, but never heard it called that.
Bare