Author Topic: Exhaust Issues UCE 500 Classic  (Read 6186 times)

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Elliotthd

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on: May 12, 2014, 02:00:44 pm
Hey guys. Has anyone else had perpetual and seemingly unending exhaust issues with their modern bullet? I have about 10,000 miles on my bike and the exhaust hasn't been right for about 9,999 of them. I had my first stock muffler break at the weld where the header pipe and the muffler join. After I got the bike back from the dealer, and a few more miles, I had one of the studs on the head where the header pipe attaches break. After I got the bike back from that repair (which was paired with some other repairs that a BRAND NEW MOTORCYCLE SHOULDN'T HAVE) my second stock muffler broke at the exact same spot. I have since replaced that with the EFI muffler from nfieldgear.com. That has leaked since I installed it as well. I've tried exhaust paste and two different muffler ties, and for some reason I'm STILL getting carbon on my brake pedal. AND NOW for seeming no reason at all, my header piper is loose in the head, even though the flange is as tight as it will go. I can freely moving my header piper back and forth. There is also a small exhaust leak to go with my newly developed issue. There doesn't seem to be any good reason for this. The bike is still under warranty, but I'm tired of taking it back to the dealer ship. Outside of exhaust issues, I've had it back to the dealership for warranty work 7 times. 7!! At this point I'll just fix the damn thing myself.

Now, before I really just roll this excuse for a motorcycle off a cliff, somebody please help me out here. Can someone tell me where I can find a copper crush gasket that fits this bike to go between the head and the header pipe. I want to install that to see if it fixes my latest issue with this thing and I'm going to weld the new muffler to the header pipe to finally be done with exhaust leaks. I am so tired of it leaking and breaking and just not being right. I have a 40 year old Honda with 80,000+ miles on it, and I've had less issues with it. This is unbelievable.
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Craig McClure

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Reply #1 on: May 12, 2014, 04:43:53 pm
Look into an aftermarket upswept of some kind that doesn't weigh a lot, fits the inlet pipe, Won't self destruct & you should do a lot better. If there is a stock header pipe gasket I'd start there.
  I have a lightweight upturned NOS 1960's Cocktail shaker on mine & like it a lot. Old photo below.  Good luck.
Best Wishes, Craig McClure


Elliotthd

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Reply #2 on: May 12, 2014, 05:14:25 pm
I already switched the muffler to the EFI one on enfieldgear. It's a hug weight saver, but I don't think weight is my issue here. It was all tight and everything was working correctly on Saturday, on Sunday I was driving and I heard a rattle and a new popping noise. I looked into a stock exhaust gasket but I can't seem to locate one. So I was going to switch it out for the copper crush gaskets that seem to be on most other types of motorcycle. I was just curious if anyone knew what size would fit the enfield.
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barenekd

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Reply #3 on: May 12, 2014, 09:28:44 pm
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/an900.php?clickkey=7239
Crush washers, check the diameter of the eshaust port and make sure you get the right one.
It sounds like the mechanic nener put a new washer in the head any time they took the pipe out.
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Elliotthd

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Reply #4 on: May 12, 2014, 09:43:48 pm
Yeah. I'm thinking when they pulled the header pipe to fix the stud, they just recycled the existing paper gasket and it has since failed. Thanks for the info though man.
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Sectorsteve

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Reply #5 on: May 12, 2014, 11:00:45 pm
Yep the stock exhaust is junk. Expensive junk. Mine cracked same spot as you and this has happened to most people that left the stock bazooka on long enough. I changed muffler to a nice chrome megaphone and bought a lot of gaskets for the header/end of header pipe as I had some leaks too. Before I had they gaskets I used gasket glue and that worked really well. It's def a bit of a weird fit (head&header pipe.) I find mine can come loose but it doesn't really leak. All I can say is persevere. It's not a big issue and easily fixed. Get some gaskets from hitchcocks. They are about $1 each and light as a feather. Don't over tighten the header bolts either. Do them up evenly and if you really aren't sure how tight to tighten them, use a torque wrench...


suitcasejefferson

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Reply #6 on: May 13, 2014, 01:12:50 am
I have 2300 miles on my stock exhaust, and other than a gold ring around it from heat damage to the chrome. I did have one of the nuts that hold the header to the cylinder head come loose, I caught it before it completely fell off. While working on that, I discovered that both studs would unscrew from the head by hand. I completely removed the header pipe (leaving the silencer in place) double nutted the studs, and snugged them up a little more, then removed the nuts, and reinstalled the header pipe, using the original gasket, just snugging up the nuts. That was 1500 miles ago, and they have not come loose again. I cannot hear a leak at the head, and there is no carbon buildup on the header.

You have to be really careful with those studs. The head is aluminum, and while the studs are steel, they are very soft steel. Being an auto mechanic, I have developed a good feel for how tight things should be. Be careful using a torque wrench. It sounds like a good idea, but the amount of torque required is so little it would take a very accurate (expensive) wrench to measure it correctly. Many people have broken off bolts while using a torque wrench (including myself)

At some point in the future I plan to get some stronger steel studs that are longer than stock, and safety wire them in place.
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Reply #7 on: May 13, 2014, 02:50:28 am
The stock exhaust gaskets aren't that bad but they tend to fail easily if reused. 

Scott


wildbill

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Reply #8 on: May 13, 2014, 06:05:18 am
once you remove the header pipe a couple of times that gasket is history. in the end the completely fall to bits and you are stuck with a pretty bad leak.
it as happened to me twice so last time i purchased 3 gasket and still have 2 for reserves.
once the new one is on a tightened - dont touch it and all is well

lets ride! LOL


Elliotthd

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Reply #9 on: May 13, 2014, 02:11:22 pm
Thanks guys. I'm going to go with a copper crush gasket over the stock paper one. While I have it apart I may just replace both studs with longer stainless ones and stainless hardware. I'm going to weld the muffler to the header pipe while it's apart as well. It's just frustrating to have to wrench so much and to have so many things go wrong with a brand new motorcycle. My Guzzi or my Harley, I wouldn't be so frustrated, it's the nature of the beast. But a bike I'm making payments on and have a factory warranty with, I shouldn't be fixing the exhaust for the 5th time and wondering what's going to go wrong next, ya know?
2013 RE C5 Classic,
2005 Honda Shadow Aero 936,
1978 CB750 Hardtail JockeyBob,
1978 Yamaha XS750 Bobber (was a Cafe)


Ducati Scotty

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Reply #10 on: May 13, 2014, 03:03:42 pm
Don't put a stainless nut on a stainless stud.  They will gall.  Better to go with one stainless and one regular steel.

http://www.estainlesssteel.com/gallingofstainless.html

Scott


ace.cafe

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Reply #11 on: May 13, 2014, 03:05:18 pm
A lot of Harley mufflers fit a 1.75" pipe. I know many Iron Barrel riders use them. Maybe you might have a take-off from one of your Harleys that might fit?

I always use brass nuts on any exhaust studs.
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Elliotthd

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Reply #12 on: May 13, 2014, 03:23:33 pm
Ace, I only own the one Harley, but you're correct, many of the 883 and 1200 motors run a 1 3/4" pipe. As well as a lot of the older Iron and Pan heads. In fact, I'm pretty sure the a lot of the older Suzuki GS and Yamaha XS motors run a 1 3/4" pipe also. Unfortunately, I don't have the parts just laying around to steal from these bikes though. Thanks for the tip on the stainless/stainless combo as well. When I build my Honda I switched the studs to stainless and used a chrome plated cap nut on the exhaust to give it a real clean look. Maybe I'll do something like that here. I just have to make sure my stud doesn't bottom out on the cap nut before the exhaust flange is tight.
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1978 Yamaha XS750 Bobber (was a Cafe)


straffordrt

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Reply #13 on: May 28, 2014, 11:17:30 am
A lot of Harley mufflers fit a 1.75" pipe. I know many Iron Barrel riders use them. Maybe you might have a take-off from one of your Harleys that might fit?

I always use brass nuts on any exhaust studs.
ACE, seen the brass nut comment a couple of times, why brass?


Kevin Mahoney

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Reply #14 on: May 28, 2014, 04:24:40 pm
The newest part number is a copper ring washer. It is much better than the original one.
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gremlin

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Reply #15 on: May 29, 2014, 09:57:13 am
Don't put a stainless nut on a stainless stud.  They will gall.  Better to go with one stainless and one regular steel.

http://www.estainlesssteel.com/gallingofstainless.html

Scott

best to avoid stainless inserted into aluminum.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_corrosion
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ace.cafe

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Reply #16 on: May 29, 2014, 12:10:39 pm
ACE, seen the brass nut comment a couple of times, why brass?
Because the brass nuts won't rust on to the studs, and they always come off nicely when you need to take them off.

We started using brass nuts at the British car shop where I worked in 1973, because we were always fighting with rusted and seized exhaust hardware which also often caused broken studs in the heads and exhaust manifolds. On all our exhaust jobs, we began using brass nuts, and when these cars came back in for some job that required exhaust removal again, the nuts came right off. No need for soaking in penetrating oil, or heating them up with a torch, or busting them off.
They worked out great.

BTW, the guy who owned that shop rode a RE Interceptor 750.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2014, 12:12:46 pm by ace.cafe »
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olhogrider

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Reply #17 on: May 29, 2014, 10:25:43 pm
Because the brass nuts won't rust on to the studs, and they always come off nicely when you need to take them off.

We started using brass nuts at the British car shop where I worked in 1973, because we were always fighting with rusted and seized exhaust hardware which also often caused broken studs in the heads and exhaust manifolds. On all our exhaust jobs, we began using brass nuts, and when these cars came back in for some job that required exhaust removal again, the nuts came right off. No need for soaking in penetrating oil, or heating them up with a torch, or busting them off.
They worked out great.

BTW, the guy who owned that shop rode a RE Interceptor 750.

Got a source for those brass nuts? I have had them on British cars too. I thought they came that way.


Kevin Mahoney

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Reply #18 on: May 29, 2014, 10:34:28 pm
The brass nuts (which I always thought was a venereal disease) are a trick that go back to at least the 1950's when I was a kid and probably before. It was standard operation practice and many cars came that way from the factory. They are a GREAT idea. Also some people think it is a good idea to use a spot of oil on them to get a true torque reading or get them over rusted threads. NEVER do that. The oil or grease only carbonize with the heat and make things worse. Use a Graphite based anti-seize - normally messy as hell).
Always remove them with a 5 point socket to avoid rounding the corners.
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ERC

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Reply #19 on: May 29, 2014, 11:07:13 pm
That's 6 point socket Kevin. Don't kick me off the site now.  ERC
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ace.cafe

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Reply #20 on: May 29, 2014, 11:07:54 pm
Got a source for those brass nuts? I have had them on British cars too. I thought they came that way.
A good hardwate supply should have them. I don't know the size you need, but you could cjeck Fastenal or McMaster-Carr.
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ERC

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Reply #21 on: May 29, 2014, 11:09:33 pm
Nice spelling Ace just trying to be like Kevin?  ERC
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Reply #22 on: May 30, 2014, 12:12:54 am
At least we knew what Ace meant
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Reply #23 on: May 30, 2014, 12:33:17 am
He has spell cjeck. ;)


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Reply #24 on: May 30, 2014, 12:39:28 am
I've noticed lots of exhaust nuts I've seen over the years are brass or copper coated.  As they don't usually need to be torqued very tight, solid brass should do fine.

Scott


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Reply #25 on: May 30, 2014, 12:43:39 am
He must have his spell check language set to "Czech"
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Reply #26 on: May 30, 2014, 01:00:30 am
I heard when he saw that word, "Czech" he said, "HELL YES!  I want it to CHECK!!",  so he poked that button.  :o
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Reply #27 on: May 30, 2014, 01:40:19 am
Rumor has it ACE has been trying to access the forum via his new smart phone.......     ;D
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ace.cafe

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Reply #28 on: May 30, 2014, 01:46:56 am
Nice spelling Ace just trying to be like Kevin?  ERC

I had to disable my autocorrect on my phone, because it was driving me crazy with  word substitutions that were wacky.
So now, when I use my phone, I have no spell check, and sometimes I fat finger the little keyboard on the screen.
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Reply #29 on: May 30, 2014, 02:08:56 am
My former boss sent an e-mail to the President of our company division. The Pres's last name is Motzkin.
He used the Spell Czecher and it changed it to "Goat Skin", and he received an immediate reply.  ::)
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