Author Topic: Anti wet sumping device for Classic / Iron types  (Read 9125 times)

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Bullet Whisperer

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Reply #15 on: July 22, 2016, 06:30:16 pm
Was there ever a follow up to this thread.Did you start producing this mod for sale-let me know --Chuck
Hi Chuck,
  I made a small number of them for a couple of our bikes and a couple for customers who wanted them. I have at least one made up and ready to go and had hoped one of the larger R.E. accessory manufacturers might have been interested in taking them on. That said, we had a big end failure in one of our machines which was equipped with one and, although the big end was over 60 years old and may have been ready to call it a day, it brought with it some doubts. On the other hand, another of my machines is still going fine, a couple of thousand miles after fitting the device and I have received no complaints from anyone who bought one.
 B.W.


Arizoni

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Reply #16 on: July 22, 2016, 07:50:05 pm
I suppose the design is going to remain a secret, even though no big or small company decided to buy the rights to it?

In the photo the new device obviously isn't the old quill bolt but what looks like a bolt and a jam nut with some JB Weld or a gray packing on it doesn't help anyone to understand what is different about it or how the new design functions.

Is there any possibility that you could at least explain how it stops wet sumping but still allows the oil needed for the big end to get thru it and into the crank when the engine is running?

Although they might not want to try to make their own, I'm sure a lot of people would be interested. :)
Jim
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1999 Miata 10th Anniversary


Chasfield

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Reply #17 on: July 23, 2016, 09:28:42 am
What about engineering some kind of spring-loaded, push-button dump valve into a regular sump drain plug - i.e. a convenient method of clearing your sump in one minute, but you can't ride off with the thing left open and cook your big end. You could configure it so that it left a very small puddle of oil after actuation so that the top end gets supplied by the scavenging pump quickly after starting.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 09:34:13 am by Chasfield »
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arindamcc

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Reply #18 on: July 24, 2016, 06:56:13 pm
Is high capacity oil pump solve that problem ?


dginfw

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Reply #19 on: July 25, 2016, 12:15:14 am
Is high capacity oil pump solve that problem ?
no, the wet sumping occurs when the engine is not running. If the piston is left at the bottom of the stroke, gravity drains the oil thru the crank and into the crankcase due to position of the crankshaft.
Dave in TX:   '01  W650- keeper
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Bullet Whisperer

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Reply #20 on: July 27, 2016, 09:00:00 am
What about engineering some kind of spring-loaded, push-button dump valve into a regular sump drain plug - i.e. a convenient method of clearing your sump in one minute, but you can't ride off with the thing left open and cook your big end. You could configure it so that it left a very small puddle of oil after actuation so that the top end gets supplied by the scavenging pump quickly after starting.
It can take a long time to drain the crankcase section of the engine when wet sumped, even by removing the strainer plug at the lower front underside of the engine, so you would probably be sat there for a long time holding a spring loaded valve open. My device prevents any oil getting in via the crank oil feed, until the engine is started. It evolved from a 500 Indian Bullet I have, which used to smoke the yard out every day when it was started for the first time, sometimes it would foul the spark plug and stall before pumping the crankcase clear. Something had to be done and this was the result - no more wet sumping  ;)
 B.W.


tooseevee

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Reply #21 on: July 27, 2016, 03:23:16 pm
It can take a long time to drain the crankcase section of the engine when wet sumped, even by removing the strainer plug at the lower front underside of the engine, so you would probably be sat there for a long time holding a spring loaded valve open. My device prevents any oil getting in via the crank oil feed, until the engine is started. It evolved from a 500 Indian Bullet I have, which used to smoke the yard out every day when it was started for the first time, sometimes it would foul the spark plug and stall before pumping the crankcase clear. Something had to be done and this was the result - no more wet sumping  ;)
 B.W.

            This is just a curiosity question as I have never experienced any wet-sumping with the AVL, but I have with panhead and cone shovel harleys whose ball-check valve is not perfect. The ball and ball seat have to be perfect or it will leak. It's simple to fix, but lazy sometimes wins .... :-[

             I had one that would leak enough in three weeks of sitting (some are worse) to leave a good puddle out the CC vent. If I rode every day no problem. All I had to do was pull the plugs and kick it over 15 or 20 times. This pumped mostly all the oil back to the tank. Plugs back in, kick it to life, no puddle.

              Would this work with an Enfield?  ??? 
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Bullet Whisperer

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Reply #22 on: July 27, 2016, 03:45:14 pm
             All I had to do was pull the plugs and kick it over 15 or 20 times. This pumped mostly all the oil back to the tank. Plugs back in, kick it to life, no puddle.

              Would this work with an Enfield?  ???
In theory, yes it would work, but you would probably need to keep kicking for a couple of hours before putting the plug back in and starting up, so probably not a popular option  :o
 B.W.